375
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[-] Machindo@lemmy.ml 39 points 1 year ago

I'm running Grafana Loki for my company now and I'll never go back to anything else. Loki acts like grep, is blazing fast and low maintenance. If it sounds like magic it kind is.


I saw this post and genuinely thought one of my teammates wrote it.

I had to manage an ELK stack and it was a full time job when we were supposed to be focusing on other important SRE work.

Then we switched to Loki + Grafana and it's been amazing. Loki is literally k8s wide grep by default but then has an amazing query language for filtering and transforming logs into tables or even doing Prometheus style queries on top of a log query which gives you a graph.

Managing Loki is super simple because it makes the trade off of not indexing anything other than the kubernetes labels, which are always going to be the same regardless of the app. And retention is just a breeze since all the data is stored in a bucket and not on the cluster.

Sorry for gushing about Loki but I genuinely was that rage wojak before we switched. I am so much happier now.

[-] JoMiran@lemmy.ml 12 points 1 year ago

We do Grafana + Prometheus for most of our clients but I think that adding Loki into the mix might be necessary. The amount of clients that are missing basic events like "you've run out of disk space...two days ago", is too damn high.

[-] darvit@lemmy.darvit.nl 7 points 1 year ago

Sounds like you need an alert/monitoring system and not a logging system. Something like nagios where you immediately get an alert if something is past its limits, and where you don't have to rely on logging.

[-] JoMiran@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 year ago

Preaching to the choir. They hire use to performance tune their app but then their IT staff manges to not notice the most basic things.

[-] Machindo@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago

I would add Alertmanager to your stack if you haven't already. It's pretty tightly integrated with prometheus. There's some canned alerting rules based on predicting disk space full in X number of days. We wire Alertmanager to Pagerduty.

[-] dan@upvote.au 1 points 1 year ago

The amount of clients that are missing basic events like "you've run out of disk space

For my personal servers, I use Netdata for this. Works pretty well.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[-] flamingo_pinyata@sopuli.xyz 35 points 1 year ago

Good luck connecting to each of the 36 pods and grepping the file over and over again

[-] whodatdair 11 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

for X in $(seq -f host%02g 1 9); do echo $X; ssh -q $X “grep the shit”; done

:)

But yeah fair, I do actually use a big data stack for log monitoring and searching… it’s just way more usable haha

[-] Semi-Hemi-Demigod@kbin.social 9 points 1 year ago

Just write a bash script to loop over them.

[-] keyez@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

You can run the logs command against a label so it will match all 36 pods

[-] NovaPrime@lemmy.ml 6 points 1 year ago

Stern has been around for ever. You could also just use a shared label selector with kubectl logs and then grep from there. You make it sound difficult if not impossible, but it's not. Combine it with egrep and you can pretty much do anything you want right there on the CLI

[-] brokenlcd@feddit.it 5 points 1 year ago

I don't know how k8s works; but if there is a way to execute just one command in a container and then exit out of it like chroot; wouldn't it be possible to just use xargs with a list of the container names?

[-] zeluko@kbin.social 9 points 1 year ago

yeah, just use kubectl and pipe stuff around with bash to make it work, pretty easy

[-] FrederikNJS@lemm.ee 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Since you are talking about pods, you are obviously emitting all your logs on stdout and stderr, and you have of course also labeled your pods nicely, so grepping all 36 gods is as easy as kubectl logs -l <label-key>=<label-value> | grep <search-term>

[-] marcos@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Let me introduce you to syslogd.

But well, it's probably overkill, and you almost certainly just need to log on a shared volume.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] SeattleRain@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

This is what I was thinking. And you can't really graph out things over time on a graph which is really critical for a lot of workflows.

I get that Splunk and Elastic or unwieldy beasts that take way too much maintenance for what they provide for many orgs but to think grep is replacement is kinda crazy.

[-] sunshine@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 year ago

That's why tmux has synchronize-panes!

[-] themoonisacheese@sh.itjust.works 16 points 1 year ago

I used to work for a very very large company and there, a team of 9 people and I's entire jobs was ensuring that the shitty qradar stack kept running (it did not want to do so). I would like to make abundantly clear that our job was not to use this stack at all, simply to keep it running. Using it was another team's job.

[-] NoneOfUrBusiness@kbin.social 10 points 1 year ago

Amazing. Depressing, but amazing.

[-] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 8 points 1 year ago

remember this shit when people talk about how we can't just give people money for doing nothing

we're already just inventing problems for people to fix so we can justify paying them

[-] xmunk@sh.itjust.works 15 points 1 year ago

Why grep log files when I can instead force corporate to pay a fuck ton of money for a Splunk license.

[-] krakenfury@lemmy.sdf.org 3 points 1 year ago

It's such an insane amount of money

[-] RoadieRich@midwest.social 14 points 1 year ago

As someone who used to troubleshoot an extremely complex system for my day job, I can say I've worked my way across the entire bell curve.

[-] 9point6@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Good tracing & monitoring means you should basically never need to look at logs.

Pipe them all into a dumb S3 bucket with less than a week retention and grep away for that one time out of 1000 when you didn't put enough info on the trace or fire enough metrics. Remove redundant logs that are covered by traces and metrics to keep costs down (or at least drop them to debug log level and only store info & up if they're helpful during local dev).

[-] DudeDudenson@lemmings.world 17 points 1 year ago

What a nice world you must live in where all your code is perfectly clean, documented and properly tracked.

[-] Skydancer@pawb.social 10 points 1 year ago

And not subject to compliance based retention standards

[-] 9point6@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

Well I didn't say anything about perfectly clean, but I agree, it's very nice to work on my current projects which we've set up our observability to modern standards when compared to any of the log vomiting services I've worked on in the past.

Obviously easier to start with everything set up nicely in a Greenfield project, but don't let perfect be the enemy of good—iterative improvements on badly designed observability nearly always pays off.

[-] marcos@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

"Log" is the name of the place you write your tracing information into.

[-] Tryptaminev@lemm.ee 5 points 1 year ago

Please excuse my ignorance, but what is grep, what are the do's and dont's of logging and why are people here talking about having an entire team maintain some pipeline just to handle logs?

[-] rodbiren@midwest.social 9 points 1 year ago

It's a command line tool which filters for all lines containing the query. So something like

cat log.txt | grep Error5

Would output only lines containing Error5

[-] porous_grey_matter@lemmy.ml 9 points 1 year ago

You can just do

grep Error5 log.txt
[-] biribiri11@lemmy.ml 12 points 1 year ago

In the back of my mind I know this is there, but the cat | grep pattern is just muscle memory at this point

[-] allywilson@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 year ago

I've been 'told off' so many times by the internet for my cat and grep combos that I still do it, then I remove the cat, it still works, and I feel better. shrug

[-] expr@programming.dev 3 points 1 year ago

Just remember that if you aren't actually concatenating files, cat is always unnecessary.

[-] MehBlah@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

for me as well.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] DmMacniel@feddit.de 4 points 1 year ago

Hmm but Kibana makes it easier to read and parse logs. And you don't need server permissions to do it.

[-] DudeDudenson@lemmings.world 10 points 1 year ago

I'm not sure if you're serious or not.

At my job they unilaterally decided that we no longer had access to our application logs in any way other than a single company wide grafana with no access control (which means anyone can see anything and seeing the stats and logs of only your stuff is a PITA).

Half the time the relevant log lĂ­nes straight up don't show up unless you use a explicit search for their content (good luck finding relevant information for an unknown error) and you're extremely limited in how many log lĂ­nes you can see at once.

Not to mention that none of our applications were designed with this platform in mind so all the logging is done in a legacy way that conforms to the idea of just grepping a log file and there's no way the sponsors will commit to letting us spend weeks adjusting our legacy applications to actually log in a way that is useful for viewing in grafana and not a complete shitshow.

I've worked with a logstash/elastic/kibana stack for years before this job and I can tell you these solutions aren't meant for seeing lines one by one or context searches (where seeing what happened right before and after matters a lot), they're meant for aggregations and analysis.

It's like moving all your stuff from one house to another in a tiny electric car. Sure technically it can be done but that's not it's purpose at all and good luck moving your fridge.

[-] TigrisMorte@kbin.social 5 points 1 year ago

And in the two prior posts, children, we can see the difference between trained and experienced.

[-] thesmokingman@programming.dev 3 points 1 year ago

Are you sure it was set up correctly before? Kibana is the tool I’ve provisioned for dev log access for years so I don’t have to give them k8s perms. I have trained teams on debugging via Kibana and used Kibana myself for figuring out where prod errors were happening.

Your first paragraph is super shitty devX. That’s not okay. Your penultimate paragraph is really what I’m asking about.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] TunaCowboy@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)
[-] DrM@feddit.de 2 points 1 year ago

Just using fluentd to push the files into an ElasticSearch DB and using Kibana as frontend is one day of work for a kubernetes admin and it works good enough (and way better than grepping logfiles from every of the 3000 pods running in a big cluster)

[-] TunaCowboy@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago
load more comments
view more: next ›
this post was submitted on 24 May 2024
375 points (100.0% liked)

Programmer Humor

37184 readers
101 users here now

Post funny things about programming here! (Or just rant about your favourite programming language.)

Rules:

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS