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submitted 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) by sabreW4K3@lazysoci.al to c/firefox@lemmy.ml

Original toot:

It has come to my attention that many of the people complaining about #Firefox's #PPA experiment don't actually understand what PPA is, what it does, and what Firefox is trying to accomplish with it, so an explainer 🧵 is in order.

Targeted advertising sucks. It is invasive and privacy-violating, it enables populations to be manipulated by bad actors in democracy-endangering ways, and it doesn't actually sell products.

Nevertheless, commercial advertisers are addicted to the data they get from targeted advertising. They aren't going to stop using it until someone convinces them there's something else that will work better.

"Contextual advertising works better." Yes, it does! But, again, advertisers are addicted to the data, and contextual advertising provides much less data, so they don't trust it.

What PPA says is, "Suppose we give you anonymized, aggregated data about which of your ads on which sites resulted in sales or other significant commitments from users?" The data that the browser collects under PPA are sent to a third-party (in Firefox's case, the third party is the same organization that runs Let's Encrypt; does anybody think they're not trustworthy?) and aggregated and anonymized there. Noise is introduced into the data to prevent de-anonymization.

This allows advertisers to "target" which sites they put their ads on. It doesn't allow them to target individuals. In Days Of Yore, advertisers would do things like ask people to bring newspapers ads into the store or mention a certain phrase to get deals. These were for collecting conversion statistics on paper ads. Ditto for coupons. PPA is a way to do this online.

Is there a potential for abuse? Sure, which is why the data need to be aggregated and anonymized by a trusted third party. If at some point they discover they're doing insufficient aggregation or anonymization, then they can fix that all in one place. And if the work they're doing is transparent, as compared to the entirely opaque adtech industry, the entire internet can weigh in on any bugs in their algorithms.

Is this a utopia? No. Would it be better than what we have now? Indisputably. Is there a clear path right now to anything better? Not that I can see. We can keep fighting for something better while still accepting this as an improvement over what we have now.

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[-] ssm@lemmy.sdf.org 29 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

The data that the browser collects under PPA are sent to a third-party (in Firefox’s case, the third party is the same organization that runs Let’s Encrypt; does anybody think they’re not trustworthy?)

I wouldn't trust anyone with data this valuable, and even assuming they're trustworthy now, who knows if they'll be in a year; especially with how much "interest" they gain by now handling this data.

and aggregated and anonymized there.

I'm just supposed to believe and trust that they will do that?

Is there a potential for abuse? Sure, which is why the data need to be aggregated and anonymized by a trusted third party.

A "trusted third party" does not exist, and will never exist.

Is this a utopia? No. Would it be better than what we have now? Indisputably. Is there a clear path right now to anything better? Not that I can see. We can keep fighting for something better while still accepting this as an improvement over what we have now.

Or I can tell advertisers to eat shit and give them nothing, like I've been doing my whole life. Has been working well so far.

[-] tja@sh.itjust.works 15 points 4 months ago

If you don't trust let's encrypt SSL certificates, then you probably should probably stop using the Internet to be safe, as probably more than half of all websites are using them.

[-] stellarorion@mastodon.social 3 points 4 months ago

@tja @ssm What's the point of SSL if anyone can get it for any purpose and the cert authorities can compromise your connection at any time. It's nice that organizations such as Let's Encrypt exist, but the system is flawed...

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this post was submitted on 13 Jul 2024
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