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this post was submitted on 10 Apr 2024
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Discord. It's extremely popular and has no direct alternatives (Matrix spaces thing isn't ready at all yet)
EDIT: I didn't know Revolt and Zulip existed. I'm doing a research on them now
Matrix is also extremely complicated to sign up for. I tried getting some tech savvy friends to sign up for Matrix the other day. Even for someone tech-savvy it is waaaaaaaay too complicated. Many of the clients don't even have a sign up option, you need to sign up elsewhere first.
Yeah...for many of these programs the onboarding is so daunting, even for those who are tech savvy. Laymen don't stand a chance with something that is that complicated. It doesn't often seem to be a technical issue either, more-so a user experience or design problem
Oh 100%. The problem is that there's a lack of UX designers and such in the Open Source community. There's technical people building stuff but they often don't know how to make a good user experience (or in some cases they don't care to).
IDK why this always gets downvoted. UI/UX some of the biggest issues with FOSS software, and is a massive barrier to entry to someone who isn't a massive computer nerd willing to put up with that shit.
I guess they take any criticism of open source as if you are against the whole movement. I don't understand either.
honestly i don't even think it's a FOSS problem, this is a problem with every UI ever made in the last three years essentially.
Unless it's literally making money off of you having an account, there is no incentive to design a good UI from the ground up. The solution here ironically, is simply don't skill issue, or document it very well.
personally when it comes to the onboarding im more on the side of "self host your own onboarding, for friends and family and shit, and then federate out from there if needed."
Theoretically doing a clean onboarding shouldn't be very difficult. More involved i suppose, but if you don't have the time to figure out how a federated instance works, (or to properly document it) you shouldn't be on the internet, you have more pressing matters to attend to.
There are instances that are not very hard to sign up for. The main issue with Matrix is instability and performance, especially when communicating with users/groups on different instances. It's really not a great experience. And the inability to properly delete messages can be a big deal too
It's inconvenient, sure, but think of it as an assurance that you're not locked in with one app.
That said, I completely agree that Matrix and Element need to work on UX, particularly making it easy for new users to adopt it as well as verification/device switching.
@SorteKanin I'd like to see that. I have already onboarded about 35 students and my whole family to matrix, nobody had any problems with signup. Bigger problem is later if they get the infamous "Unable to decrypt message" error.
Yeah. I still don't understand all the encryption stuff. I lost all my encrypted texts even after I used my recovery pass phrase on a new session.
Can't relate. It's not harder to get your hands on a matrix account in comparison to a mail account. And for those that want it even easier, just download Element and you are guided through the default registration at matrix.org
I keep hearing people recommend signal messenger as an alternative to discord, and honestly that's the most obvious sign you don't actually use discord
Yeah signal is amazing for one to one or small groups, but not for what discord servers are used for.
But to be honest, many discord servers are used for things they really shouldn't be used for... Like code documentation and bug tracking
Well some people use Discord as a messenger for some reason and for them Signal is probably the best but yea it's not a Discord alternative at all
Revolt is very promising, not ready yet but already feels very similar to Discord
The privacy policy of their app's captcha solution is horrendous so no thank you
Doesn't seem that bad, when you go to log in it checks your IP, length of time on the site and mouse movements.
The Revolt's policy is not that bad. Look at the hCaptcha's one
That's the part of hCaptchas policy that's relevant to Revolt.
Did you miss these parts or are they inapplicable?
I based my assumptions on the parts in Revolts privacy policy, since reading the privacy policy of hCatpcha it alludes that each 'vendor' can select how much data they'd like to collect I assumed that Revolt only allowed them to collect IP, length of time on site and mouse movements. While they do sell information, they claim it to be anonymised and I contacted support to see how they did that for IP addresses.
Which is why I don't really mind. The information they have of me is at most how my cursor moved, how long I took to Submit a login request, Submit a registration request, Submit a password reset / email resend request and an obfuscated IP. Seems OK to me.
Tbh I forgot about the part about vendors limiting the data. I was focused on other ones. And I think Revolt itself is pretty trustworthy so they should limit it (hopefully). I guess I'll try it. I really want to be a part of good open-source projects
I get it, though I try to remind myself that perfection is the enemy of good. Especially in comparison to Discord which makes its money through [???] and is somehow only getting worse.
Discord is a commercial proprietary product with questionable owners. Of course it's getting worse all the time
Especially with the upcoming implementation of ads. Really sucks that many communities and software support (who should have just had forums) are deeply embedded into it and will have to start from scratch and lose any and all helpful content. Its hard to see big communities moving to anything else anytime soon, even of there was a great Foss alternative. It would indeed be amazing to have one in the first place
I think what’s even worse than ads is many channels now require verification through a phone number if you want to write something. Not sure when that became a thing but I just recently ran into this roadblock and noped tf out.
I thought the Discord ads drama was an April Fools joke?
You had me for a second, lol. Unfortunately it is not an April fools joke :/ luckily for us though, the worse the application gets, the higher a chance a Foss alternative will emerge from a madlad who was sick of discord's shit
https://adguard.com/en/blog/ads-discord-blocking-adguard.html
Adoption is always the main issue, as we can see here on the Fediverse. It's crazy how even technically-inclined people flock to discord. So many 3d printing communities are on there, people who install custom debian distros on raspberry pis, solder wires, crimp connectors and assemble open source machines, still fall into the trap.
Hmm I really hope so
https://zulip.com/ is likely your best alternative. It's more a Slack copy than Discord but the features are there
Revolt Chat
If you're talking about voice channels specifically, then there is Mumble.
If you're talking about chat rooms, old school solution is IRC and we have XMPP that works fine for most people.
No I meant an app that looks similar and contains most of the features (servers specifically) so it's easier for not tech savvy users to get into. Someone suggested Revolt but its privacy (as in sending the data to not privacy respecting third parties) is questionable so idk if I can consider it a good enough alternative
Something like Revolt could maybe be a replacement for discord
Lol
There is a project, but it's really early in it's development. It's called Cabal. Has a nice desktop client, looks kinda like Discord. It's p2p, so no server required. BUT AGAIN, VERY EARLY IN DEVELOPMENT.
https://github.com/cabal-club
Not something you should use, but look out for how the development is going.
There seem to be quite a few projects. It's slowing the development down. It would be better if everyone focused on one. But peer to peer is interesting. I'm wondering how much disk space it will use a day if I'm in a group with like 100k people though