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The Party of Christian Values
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this post was submitted on 29 Jan 2024
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Doesn't it? I think when Jesus said "But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also." Matthew 5:39 he meant put up with abuse, mistreatment, and injustice - do not resist an evil person and do not retaliate when attacked.
I think when Jesus said "love your enemies [...] Be perfect" Matthew 5:44, 48 he meant love your enemies and be perfect.
I think when Jesus said "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor" Matthew 19:21 he meant sell your possessions and give to the poor.
A lot of supply-side Jesus followers say Jesus supports the troops, and that the eye of the needle the camel needs to go through isn't actually the eye of a needle - but a gate.
I think the above quotes are good things to do, eventho I'm not an ethical enough person to do them. I also think all the supernatural things Jesus is quoted as saying is bullshit, and that it's better to be honest than to repeat a bunch of stupid fairy tales.
The biggest lie the Religious Right repeats is by rejecting that Jesus would be a progressive.
Jesus (at least as depicted by the Bible) advocated nothing about hurting people who were different, and preached tolerance throughout his life.
No. That is you picking and choosing verses. Which I can do as well.
He was quite clear that his way was the only way to heaven and what's more just saying you followed him wasn't enough. You can't be tolerant of other views when you are telling people that the holders of other views are going to burn in hell and even those who agree with you might still not measure up.
He was quite clear that you couldn't follow him and have a good relationship with people who didn't. That outsiders would hate you and you would hate them. That the very family unit was a snare to keep you away from him. Again this is a hurtful non-tolerant view.
Then he told his followers of the time of his wrath was coming where he would torture those who opposed him and his followers would go around murdering many tossing the bodies at his feet.
Most of what you're saying don't contradict progressivism.
The things that do, I would say from the other reply to you are pretty controversial interpretations or contexts, or downright so mis-explained by you that people aren't able to guess what verses you mean.
I'm not a Christian, but I'm not going to bury my head from seeing how progressive their namesake was.
How do you unify the absolute obedience to God with a secular society? How do you unify strict adherence to all the commandments with a secular government? How do you unify god ordained leadership with democracy?
Very well. Show me what verse I am wrong about and the correct understanding. Then explain how you determined that and how you determines that Christian leaders and thinkers have been so wrong for so long about the meaning of these passages?
Which is why he spoke out in support of the LGBT, religious tolerance, and against slavery? Oh wait, he didn't.
Render unto Caesar? Jesus' preaching seems clearly to favor things like welfare and social sharing over blasphemy laws. He directly broke the religious mandates of his people in favor of helping those in need.
Part of my objection is that many of us couldn't even figure out what verses you meant. Name a verse that clearly shows Jesus must support the political Right and then we can discuss it.
It might surprise you, but Jesus didn't live in 20th Century America. With that in mind:
LGBT - This is literally why I argue that Christians inject anti-gay rhetoric. He DIDN'T speak out about how to treat gay people in an empire where homosexuality was largely tolerated. Short of him turning to the camera and starting to comment on video games, one wouldn't expect him to talk about gay rights, or abortion, or any 20th century comedy.
While he tried to convert pagans, he was accepting of them in a smaller region where they were largely outcasts. Pagan influences are a large part of why Christianity doesn't look like Judaism-plus-plus. The Jewish people were ruled by a pagan empire, and yet again we have no speech against it.
In this one you might have a point. But I think you're stretching if looking at it as an outsider. Through all the books of progressive teaching, focusing on the fact he fails to take the time to condemn slavery seems like you're showing your hand if it's your reason for rejecting his general progressivism.
Unlike Christians, I don't think Jesus was perfect. I'm convinced if he were alive running for office, he'd be Far Left.
It meant both. It was a clever pun. At least according to some understanding. Doesn't matter the sentence only makes sense if the gate is small.
There’s no evidence to support this. It’s an elaborate bit of apologia that rich Christians use to try to dodge the fact they shouldn’t be rich. The copium is so strong that people will dig up pictures of specific gates (from centuries later) to try to back it up.
I always heard it in the context of trivia, like the eye of the needle was a really small gate used to allow pedestrian access to the city while allowing a wall to still keep out armies. A camel still wouldn't fit by design, so I guess I've never heard it in the context of apologetics of rich people, or maybe I assumed the people I was talking to were being good-faith.
Which English translation do you prefer and recommend? I like NET because of it's less-rights reserved copyright, but for ease of understanding I prefer translations that use contemporary language instead of just footnotes.
I think this characterization of turning the other cheek is more complete and supported by the nearby text, even for someone like me who prefers Jefferson's eliding.
Re: "do not resist", are there other nearby passages that expand it to more than just refraining from violence, into actually resisting evil persons? I ethically agree with your expanded position of trying to overcome injustice in this world - but doesn't the quotes of Jesus in the canonical books rely instead on waiting for justice in heaven and hell, and not on Earth?