543
Dave Chappelle fills Netflix special with jokes about trans and disabled people
(www.independent.co.uk)
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 01 Jan 2024
543 points (100.0% liked)
News
23353 readers
2718 users here now
Welcome to the News community!
Rules:
1. Be civil
Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.
2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.
Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.
3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.
Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.
4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.
Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.
5. Only recent news is allowed.
Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.
6. All posts must be news articles.
No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.
7. No duplicate posts.
If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.
8. Misinformation is prohibited.
Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.
9. No link shorteners.
The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.
10. Don't copy entire article in your post body
For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
The Independent knew what they were doing.
They take a couple of his lines completely out of context, put it in a headline, and people can't wait to post a comment about how much they hate him.
I wonder how many of you have been given your opinion of him and never actually watched him?
I will definitely admit this latest special was "meh". But man, I'm pretty confident most of the commenters here have strong opinions of this special without ever watching it.
This thread reads like a bunch of Boomers were given a headline that "Biden paid for coke that Hunter snorted off hookers butt, in the Whitehouse.", and couldn't wait to post how much they hate Biden and that he's a criminal, or whatever.
okay, so you watched him and i didn't (got rid of netflix a few years ago).
did he make a bunch of jokes about trans people and people with disabilities? what's the context you got that i need to more accurately understand this performance?
edit a word
I'm not going to defend or attack him.
I would have to do half his routine for the context to work and I am not interested in doing that.
But just think, for a moment, about all the stupid shit boomers say, believe, and respond to, from just a headline. When they do it, you get frustrated and angry for them going off, half cocked, over nonsense.
Then realize, you are responding the same way. Not the same beliefs, mind you, but letting yourself get riled up about what someone else said about a third person.
Crap like this article is written solely for people to have an emotional response to it. They are monetarily motivated to do it. Revenue is driven by Internet traffic and ad clicks.
The reason data is so valuable is because they know what you react to. They see what generates that visceral response and then generate/tailor content because it drives viewers and clicks.
Take it a step further and you can see how it is used to generate political support and sales.
Don't let yourself get manipulated by an online article.
I am NOT telling you to like Dave Chappelle or that he's a good guy. I am telling you that the responses here, on this post are exactly why it is being done. Both his standup AND the way the article is written.
It's not about getting 'riled up about what someone else said about a third person'. You don't need to see a whole special or context to know transphobic or bigoted language when it's so prevalent. What he has said, whether he was joking or not, was already hurtful, and there is no quote or context that isn't him doubling down further.
I get what you are saying though and I agree, but I do think it's tough to not have any kind of emotional response when people are encouraging things that question your humanity or right to live.
The article itself doesn't even elaborate on the headline. It doesn't provide any real examples and just makes claims without allowing the reader any sort of useful information.
I watched the show and I can provide some context.
He did make some jokes but they weren't about trans so much but about his relationship with the community.
The handicap jokes were about making fun of himself and his comedy and how he is viewed by the trans community. It was expressed for shock value too. Said in a way to show he doesn't care who he makes fun of, that no people are safe from his humor. It fell kind of flat for me but it did not "fill his routine" as the article states.
The punching down joke was clearly sarcasm.
That being said, I found his standup to be as you described. Kind of tired and old.
He told a story about meeting Jim Carrey, while he was filming Man in the Moon. Jim was immersed in his role and everyone was talking to him, as if he was Andy Kaufman, even off set. Dave compared that to trans. Like he knew he was talking to one gender but he had to pretend they were another gender. He didn't explicitly say it that way, but that is what I inferred.
I have been a huge Chappelle fan. I have seen him really highlight hypocrisy and double standards in a cutting, but hilarious and insightful way.
But, I felt this latest standup was not particularly witty or insightful. At least when his set invloved LGBTQ. I felt he was just poking the bear to have the last word kind of thing.
His Jim Carrey story just made me feel sad because it made me believe that he really doesn't understand. Jim Carrey was trying to become someone he truly wasn't. Someone, whom is trans, is trying to become the person they truly believe they are.
He had some good insight, for me, about what it meant to him, when Wil Smith hit Chris Rock and he segued that into people's dreams and the underlying theme of the show. But then he taked about them both being men and it just reminded me that toxic masculinity is a real thing, but his set did not address it.
He talked about Lil Nas X and even though it was meant to come across as supportive, it felt forced.
But overall, I felt the jokes that involved trans were low hanging at best, and baiting at worst.
However, this "article" and the response to it, is exactly why he told those jokes the way he did. The Independent doesn't care, they are just playing the game to get clicks.
The most passionate response to Dave's routine shouldn't be more than, "That was it?"
It made you sad because it's anti-trans.
Chapelle, in that cute little anecdote, is literally denying the existence of trans identity and claiming they're just acting and it's a choice. That is the way that the right is trying to erase trans identity, and it's the same playbook they used when attacking the gay community (i.e by claiming it's a lifestyle choice and not an issue of identity).
As for him not "understanding", bluntly, that is a choice. He's not some misguided poor soul. He has access to all the information you and I do. He could educate himself. But he's made a decision, and that decision is to deny the existence of trans people.
Frankly, it seems to me your fondness for Chapelle is leading you to downplay his beliefs and his behaviour.
True, news platforms definitely know how to game these controversies, thank you for giving me an idea of what the thing actually is hah. I'm not surprised it wasn't a hate-filled tirade, as people might be inclined to think with this headline.
Like you said though I feel more sad than anything usually in relation to this sort of thing. Even if he is saying offensive things, I think you are right that he genuinely doesn't understand what being trans really is and that ignorance can be hard to separate from more malicious bigotry. Even supportive people can come off as "oh what's the harm, they can be a woman if they want to pretend" at times.
If a person isn't queer or trans, or good friends with people who are, it can probably be hard to understand how much hate still exists. A comedian might think these people just need tougher skin, not realizing the potential harm, so I don't usually blame them much.
Watch it. Stop getting your opinions from social media.
I'm not going to watch every stand up special ever made just to keep up with the news. Either tell me what context allegedly changes things or don't and shut up.
Or just don't get into internet arguments about shit you don't know anything about.
I'm not even arguing. I'm stating that the fact that I don't have enough hours in the day to watch everything that comes out. When the Ghostbusters reboot came out I said "Wow, that looks like shit!" and moved on. Some people tried to tell me I can't trust a trailer, so I read the reviews and they confirmed what I suspected. Then people tried to tell me that I can't trust reviews either, so I said "Fuck you!" and moved on, because by that logic I'd have to see everything that catches the eye of the media and I have neither the time, money, nor energy to do that. I'm not going to put myself through something I don't think I'll enjoy just because someone on the internet told me to.
The fact that nobody in this thread is able to provide additional context tells me there isn't any. This should be easy. Just do it.
See you'll note I'm not arguing here because I don't know shit about this special. I've been partying, because it's new years, so I haven't seen it.
Imagine if you just didn't get all pissed off about a thing you don't understand completely.
it's not anything i'm interested in watching, honestly.
I mean, did he do it or not? If he did, then your argument is "You guys have to watch the jokes to see if you think it's funny or not before judging whether it's tasteless."