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this post was submitted on 10 Sep 2023
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Maybe you should join hexbear
Maybe you should explain how it’s okay for America to steal from another country?
Then they should take the ship, and give back the oil. This isn’t about law, it’s about power and control. And it should be considered wrong by any decent, civilized person.
I think you are being unreasonable in that argument. It's not like they have the oil in cargo containers and can transfer it from one ship to another outside of port. The oil IS the ship.
Sure they could dump it in the ocean? Which would be the dumbest of all options.
Or they could seize the ships, and tow them back to port. Which looks like the options they took.
You should read up on what’s happening before commenting.
So now I have to prove my geopolitical stance on an engineering and logistics problem?
I can only give the facts, what people do with the politics is their own prerogative.
The logistics are pedantic. They took the ships under civil forfeiture. Made the company pay to transport the oil to Houston. Took the oil and sold it. They could have left the oil. Arrested the captain and crew. And fined the company. They stole it for… reasons.
It is about power and control. We are uaing sanctions on Iran and many officials in Iran as leverage for the nuclear deal as well as other human rights violations. And this company fucked up real bad, otherwise we would have let them do it. So much oil gets sold in Iran, blended in Malaysia, and sold to China at a reduced price for accepting the contraband oil.
Iran: US sanctions violating human rights of all living there, say UN experts
Iran is violating the human rights of all living there. Do you have such a weak memory? And while they do that they want to build nukes? Fucks sake.
The sanctions are exacerbating the human rights issues. It’s in the article. From the United Nations.
This article is compelling, and I'm a bit torn. I didn't realize Iran has had these sanctions since 1979. I should know that, I paid attention in hiatory class. When the sanctions are framed on a shorter time scale, the JCPOA in 2018 and sanctioning of officials in 2022... those make more sense. But this 40+ year long policy was not a good choice. I imagine the Iranian people will just suffer for the rest of my lifetime unless we shift methods.
Another country? What are you talking about my dude? An American company bought oil from Iran (in violation of US law), and had the oil they bought seized.
You’re late. And that’s not what happened.
It takes all of three minutes to click through to the court order here. All three companies do significant business in the US, but the money to buy the oil was US dollars, and came from Oaktree Capital which is based in Los Angeles.
Which is (and this might be a shocker) in the USA.
Iran is not the USA. The sanctions aren’t recognized. Therefore, any laws America makes does not have to be complied with.Your arguing US law. I’m arguing international. They are not the same. The United States of America does not have authority over the world, despite what you wish. Source. Even the UN says the sanctions are illegal.
No shit... these companies operate in the US, which makes US law applicable to them.
Sigh…
So, what you're saying is, international law should be superceded by domestic law?
That's how it normally works, yes... particularly if the country in question is not a signatory to the 'international law' in question.
Perfect. I'll let China and Russia know.
That they can issue court orders to companies that do business in their territory?
They ... they know...
That domestic policy supercedes international law? That's literally been the entire argument for sanctions against China: that their domestic policy violates international law and that under the rules-based international order someone needs to do something about it.
Sorry I am finding it very difficult to follow your argument.
Can you explain what "international law" you believe US sanctions to have broken?
Other way around: the US is projecting international law on domestic issues that, as we've already established, should be governed by domestic policy before falling to international law.
As we've already established, condemnation and punitive actions against a country for unilateral domestic policy decisions doesn't make sense, even if they are in violation of international law.
Bro I've been on roundabouts less circular than your logic
🤷♀️ I've been on some pretty non circular roundabouts too
international law?
That’s the point. International designations through the UN are nebulous and practically unenforceable. Countries choose to abide by international regulations or they don’t.