673
Politics venn
(lemmy.dbzer0.com)
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 09 Dec 2024
673 points (100.0% liked)
Lefty Memes
4514 readers
29 users here now
An international (English speaking) socialist Lemmy community free of the "ML" influence of instances like lemmy.ml and lemmygrad. This is a place for undogmatic shitposting and memes from a progressive, anti-capitalist and truly anti-imperialist perspective, regardless of specific ideology.
Serious posts, news, and discussion go in c/Socialism.
If you are new to socialism, you can ask questions and find resources over on c/Socialism101.
Please don't forget to help keep this community clean by reporting rule violations, updooting good contributions and downdooting those of low-quality!
Rules
0. Only post socialist memes
That refers to funny image macros and means that generally videos and screenshots are not allowed. Exceptions include explicitly humorous and short videos, as well as (social media) screenshots depicting a funny situation, joke, or joke picture relating to socialist movements, theory, societal issues, or political opponents. Examples would be the classic case of humorous Tumblr or Twitter posts/threads. (and no, agitprop text does not count as a meme)
1. Socialist Unity in the form of mutual respect and good faith interactions is enforced here
Try to keep an open mind, other schools of thought may offer points of view and analyses you haven't considered yet. Also: This is not a place for the Idealism vs. Materialism or rather Anarchism vs. Marxism debate(s), for that please visit c/AnarchismVsMarxism.
2. Anti-Imperialism means recognizing capitalist states like Russia and China as such
That means condemning (their) imperialism, even if it is of the "anti-USA" flavor.
3. No liberalism, (right-wing) revisionism or reactionaries.
That includes so called: Social Democracy, Democratic Socialism, Dengism, Market Socialism, Patriotic Socialism, National Bolshevism, Anarcho-Capitalism etc. . Anti-Socialist people and content have no place here, as well as the variety of "Marxist"-"Leninists" seen on lemmygrad and more specifically GenZedong (actual ML's are welcome as long as they agree to the rules and don't just copy paste/larp about stuff from a hundred years ago).
4. No Bigotry.
The only dangerous minority is the rich.
5. Don't demonize previous and current socialist experiments or (leading) individuals.
We must constructively learn from their mistakes, while acknowledging their achievements and recognizing when they have strayed away from socialist principles.
(if you are reading the rules to apply for modding this community, mention "Mantic Minotaur" when answering question 2)
6. Don't idolize/glorify previous and current socialist experiments or (leading) individuals.
Notable achievements in all spheres of society were made by various socialist/people's/democratic republics around the world. Mistakes, however, were made as well: bureaucratic castes of parasitic elites - as well as reactionary cults of personality - were established, many things were mismanaged and prejudice and bigotry sometimes replaced internationalism and progressiveness.
- Absolutely no posts or comments meant to relativize(/apologize for), advocate, promote or defend:
- Racism
- Sexism
- Queerphobia
- Ableism
- Classism
- Rape or assault
- Genocide/ethnic cleansing or (mass) deportations
- Fascism
- (National) chauvinism
- Orientalism
- Colonialism or Imperialism (and their neo- counterparts)
- Zionism
- Religious fundamentalism of any kind
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
I haven't seen anyone say Trump winning is a good thing, nor have I seen anyone say the DPRK is a paradise (closest to that is people saying the DPRK has living standards around the level of Cuba these days). Where are you finding these people at significant enough numbers to cause you anguish? Legitimate question here, you're calling for Left Unity but it seems like you're misframing others at best, which goes against that ideal.
I will admit that I'm exaggerating out of frustration, but the idea that North Korea is "Actually a real nice place to live, preferable to America in some respects" is one I hear a lot (I do hear about China being a paradise)
And for the record I was kicked out of my local Socialist Chapter for refusing to endorse a Green Party Candidate who was openly transphobic and talking about nixing expanding healthcare access in favor of just "curing autism with crystals", the head of which responded to by calling me a rape apologist, which doesn't make any sense. (Also a white cisguy calling a transgirl a "Rape Apologist" for not going along with transphobia and ableism is sus)
I was hardly the only nay-sayer, he got a lot of backlash for supporting this person, but the fact that I wouldn't play ball with one of my oppressors seemed to really piss in this guy's cornflakes.
Wasn't the only odd thing about the guy, he actually condemened Bernie during the 2020 primaries, citing a "Refusal to advocate for violence against the police" as "Proof that he just doesn't care!", when that was never a realistic thing to expect a candidate to do.
So I have dealt with a lot of crazy unreasonable types "on the front lines" so to speak.
Also I sadly have dealt with a lot of "Even though it means letting Trump win, we can't lift a finger to help Biden/Hillary/Kamela because they're literally not as bad as Trump on this one issue."
My point still remains, can we please just focus on actually being productive before we turn on each other?
I can't speak for the chapter you were a part of, but I think the idea that the DPRK isn't a hellhole, actually, and is more like Cuba as an impoverished yet slowly improving society is a valid point to take against common allegations as such. The PRC is certainly no paradise either, but it has rapidly improved, and I think acknowledging that as well is also valid. I questioned what you alleged because I haven't seen anyone say the DPRK is paradise, period, nor the idea of Trump being better than Harris.
It happens all over Lemmy, at least it does for me. Anecdotes aren't typically considered reliable.
Don't be obtuse, he was obviously being hyperbolic.
But doesn't that hyperbole get in the way of a desire for Left Unity? If someone says "Harris and Trump serve similar interests" and someone interprets that as "Trump is better than Harris, actually," that fundamentally changes the point the person was making. Hyperbole is only useful as long as the quantitative change in a claim doesn't change the fundamental equation, if it does, it becomes strawmanning.
No.
Gotcha, so me saying you hate all Leftists is rhetorically fine and just "hyperbole?"
I think that would be a great use of hyperbole, actually. The venn diagram is hilariously accurate, and I think you're being obnoxious.
Then I disagree with your understanding of rhetoric, that doesn't make any sense.
Congratulations on being a perfect example of the bullshit the op was complaining about.
In what manner? Questioning the existence of DPRK worshippers and those preferring Trump to Harris among Marxists?
Ha, looks like we've been brigaded by beehaw and .ml.
How can you come to that conclusion without knowing my honest opinion of leftists?
How can the original commenter come to their conclusion without knowing the opinions of Leftists?
They were making a joke. Were you?