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submitted 1 year ago by const_void@lemmy.ml to c/linux@lemmy.ml
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[-] doctorcrimson@lemmy.today 117 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

It's kind of weird that Gabe Newell et al shows this much support and appreciation for the long term future than most of the people from his generation, referring more to when he entered the industry than when he was born. In theory, he could profit more in the now instead of investing in a future he might not be around to enjoy, but instead chose the high road.

It's also kind of weird that a person not being scum in a position of power is weird to me. Pretty low standard we've set for humanity.

[-] trafficnab@lemmy.ca 40 points 1 year ago

I'm not trying to hate on Gabe Newell or Valve or anything (and not to say that it isn't a pretty objectively win-win) but I think there's some pretty easily explainable motivation behind this that isn't just "out of the kindness of their hearts"

I think the product they intend to sell is actually the software and services (there's a reason the Deck seems to be sold basically at cost), they're betting on these PC-based portable gaming devices taking off and being a viable segment of the market that other hardware companies will want to invest into, and if they do, what highly functional and easy to integrate (since it's all open source) operating system (and its subsequent game store integration) might they be more likely to use?

And why push upstream? They're by far the largest PC games provider, so more games running on more (Linux) devices can only really serve to financially benefit them

[-] Rednax@lemmy.world 52 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

So if Gabe suceeds, we get a gaming ecosystem with different hardware sellers, all using a platform that other software sellers are not blocked from using (Linux)? And the only reason Valve wins, is because they invested into providing the best possible distribution platform on Linux?

This does not make them evil by any standard I know. It just sounds like a solid long term business plan.

[-] GodsKillerKirb@sh.itjust.works 29 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

So if Gabe suceeds, we get a gaming ecosystem with different hardware sellers, all using a platform that other software sellers are not blocked from using (Linux)? And the only reason Valve wins, is because they invested into providing the best possible distribution platform on Linux?

Yes. 100% correct


I would also like to add that I think the main reason for the Steam Deck runs Linux is because Gabe Newell himself has literally stated that he loves Linux and FOSS, which results in only Gabe, but the majority, if not all, of Valve wanting Linux to be a the gaming platform that it deserves to be.

[-] Barbarian@sh.itjust.works 13 points 1 year ago

There's also the fact that he was extremely worried about Microsoft trying to go the Apple route and restrict program installs to their store, including games. That would have killed Steam overnight. That's when the investment into Linux really started ramping up.

That's not evil or anything, but it is identifying a potential company-killing vulnerability and trying to reduce the impact somewhat.

[-] GodsKillerKirb@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 year ago

Not only would it kill steam, but also kill so many other applications. It could even just straight up kill Windows as a whole.

Switching to Linux on all my computers was literally one of the best decisions I have ever made. Granted it was 5.5 years ago, but I'm glad I was able cuz microsoft started to get worse like a year later.

What Microsoft started doing recently, pushing users built-in ads to use their products, makes me more glad that I'm a Linux user so I don't have to deal with Microsoft's bullshit.

[-] GodsKillerKirb@sh.itjust.works 7 points 1 year ago

So if Gabe suceeds, we get a gaming ecosystem with different hardware sellers, all using a platform that other software sellers are not blocked from using (Linux)? And the only reason Valve wins, is because they invested into providing the best possible distribution platform on Linux?

Yes. 100% correct


I would also like to add that I think the main reason for the Steam Deck running Linux is because Gabe Newell himself has literally stated that he loves Linux and FOSS, which results in only Gabe, but the majority, if not all, of Valve wanting Linux to be a the gaming platform that it deserves to be. It also the reason why Valve forked WINE and made Proton.

[-] conciselyverbose@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago

Well, he likes Linux

And doesn't trust Microsoft not to be anticompetitive and tank his business if they think they can get away with it.

[-] valkyrie@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago

I think one of the main reasons that was missed here is that. Once Microsoft started pushing the windows store as a way to get software on windows Valve started making these moves for Linux. If Microsoft decided one day to lock all software to the windows store this is valves backup plan / bargaining chip.

[-] winterayars@sh.itjust.works 16 points 1 year ago

I think Valve being a private corporation rather than publicly traded is a huge contributor to that. If they were publicly traded it wouldn't matter what Gabe thought, they'd have a legal obligation to make money for the shareholders and the way that has played out has been "legal obligation to consume the company's future for short term profit". As a private corporation they have the ability to think about the future

[-] GamingChairModel@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago

That's not a requirement of publicly traded companies. Any corporation has the same obligation to put shareholder interests first, whether it's closely held (like Valve) or publicly traded but still under the founder's control (like Facebook) or publicly traded with no one owner that exercises significant control (like IBM). The court case that established that corporations have a duty to shareholders above everyone else (Dodge v. Ford Motor Company) involved a closely held corporation (not public) and also confirmed that the corporation's management can exercise its own judgment and discretion in prioritizing long term over short term gains, or vice versa.

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[-] Gsus4@feddit.nl 2 points 1 year ago

There was Artifact 🤦

[-] KpntAutismus@lemmy.world 91 points 1 year ago

a good product is the best advertising. make linux usable as a daily driver, and people come flowing in from the shithole that is windows.

[-] MotoAsh@lemmy.world 47 points 1 year ago

Linux is a usable daily driver if you're tech savvy enough. Some distros are even kind enough to be daily driveable by non tech savvy, at least for the normal stuff.

At this point, it's possible, but no normie is ever going to know what distros are easy and won't be getting through an OS installation anyways.

[-] AnonTwo@kbin.social 43 points 1 year ago

Linux is a usable daily driver if you’re tech savvy enough.

A daily driver shouldn't need you to be tech savy. There should just be an added benefit for being tech savy.

[-] AProfessional@lemmy.world 28 points 1 year ago

Windows is not usable if you aren’t tech savvy. See young people who grew up on iOS/Android.

I think Linux is very good already and only improving.

[-] AnonTwo@kbin.social 10 points 1 year ago

Pretty sure those users you're talking about don't understand desktop controls in general, and would be even worse on Linux. Because when we talk about tech savy we're not talking about basic controls.

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[-] cmnybo@discuss.tchncs.de 10 points 1 year ago

Many distros are actually very easy to install and setup. The problem is that Linux is not preinstalled on most computers.

[-] kaba0@programming.dev 2 points 1 year ago
[-] cmnybo@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 1 year ago

Open the PDF in Okular, click Tools->Digitally Sign, select the certificate you want to sign it with, and save the signed PDF.

[-] taj@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 year ago

To be fair, my husband is about as far from tech savvy as they come, and he's been running Linux for years on his laptop. Every 2-3 years I upgrade him. Sometimes just within distros (Ubuntu 12.04 to 16.04 say. Other times, I've moved him distros (to fedora) or back to Ubuntu. Otherwise? I don't touch his system. He's been happy for years.

[-] brayd@discuss.tchncs.de 19 points 1 year ago

I disagree while agreeing. The biggest reason people use windows is simply because its pre-installed. That's the same reason people use Edge on Windows or Bing as their search engine. They get it preinstalled and don't know how to change it.

If you install anyone Linux and give them a simple and easy distro preinstalled they're usually fine with a few words about how to use it, update it and install stuff. Especially if they're not tech savvy because in this case they wouldn't know exactly how to use Windows either. I mean look at companies: how many employees use Windows in their daily work but still don't know how to actually usw windows? They get teached to use their software and tools but not the OS itself and have to figure things out on the OS level if they would want to change something on Windows too.

My observation was that people that are not tech savvy find it easier to understand some beginner friendly Linux distros than Windows.

If on the other hand a person is used to use Windows and knows how to actually use Windows it's harder for them to switch because things are just different on Linux. For me it's hard and annoying to use Windows which I have to do at work since February. Before that I used Linux in private my whole life, I used it in school because my school never used Windows as one of the few schools in my country and my last employer also used Linux. And from that perspective I can say that Windows is hard and not intuitive. It's just being used because it's being used. I guess you could compare it to Whatsapp vs Signal. From an objective standpoint Signal is better but most people still use WhatsApp because others use it and because it comes preinstalled on some Android phones.

[-] bou@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago

@brayd I can confirm. I have installed Fedora Silverblue to a number of non-techies including my wife, her parents and several of her friends; I walked them through the system for a few minutes and explained basic operation. Most of them have been using it for years, never reported any sort of problem and even expressed being much more satisfied than before.

[-] pBaesse@lemmy.eco.br 1 points 1 year ago

Totally agree!

[-] Contend6248@feddit.de 7 points 1 year ago

It won't get more normie than SteamOS, it is literally console kind of simplicity with the option to switch to a full blown DE.

[-] MotoAsh@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Is it really really easy to install? Several distros are extremely smooth experiences if you don't have completely weird hardware to support, but their installation is still an actual OS install procedure. As easy as Windows to install, but almost no one HAS to install their Windows like with Linux.

If steam OS is coming with Wine et. al. already set up (and it'd be silly if it didn't) that definitely gives it a leg up on most distros for normies, at least.

[-] Contend6248@feddit.de 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Normies don't install any OS, they buy devices with it pre-installed and if they fuck their installation up, they search someone who does it for them. Which is (almost) impossible for them to do when the OS has it's root partition as read-only, like the SteamOS

[-] AnonTwo@kbin.social 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

You'd have to check one of the side-distros. SteamOS itself has no official installer yet, only available pre-installed on steamdeck.

There are distros that are organized to recreate it for normal installation though.

Though to be fair, that's pretty "normie" to not have to experience the installation process at all. Most people will just use what shipped with their PC.

[-] MotoAsh@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Yea, install availability and upgrades gone wrong are areas Linux needs a bit more progress, though I stand by that Linux is plenty good for daily driving once you're staring at a GUI you're comfortable with on the friendlier OS's

I guess also app availability... Snap packs fucking suck and even normal package repos aren't the simplest thing to deal with if something is only available in EPEL or some similar situation.

Though is that really unique to Linux? As soon as you do something outside of any normal program, it's all wizardry to normies.

[-] AnonTwo@kbin.social 3 points 1 year ago

I'd say Executables (for all their risks) make it pretty easy for less savy users to get apps not immediately made available to them, given there are definite security issues.

But I will be fair that I think Linux's flatpaks are helping a bit with making apps more available without worrying about the distro. Plus proton/wine lets users grab some of the useful exe's from windows.

It's improving I do agree, but it's something that will hopefully keep improving.

[-] Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 1 year ago

Linux is a usable daily driver if you're tech savvy enough.

So it's not..?

[-] MotoAsh@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

It is after the right distro is installed. The only reason you have to be tech savvy at all to do the basics is because it has to be installed.

[-] winterayars@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 year ago

It's also really difficult to get into if you don't already have an "in". Yeah, some distros are pretty easy to use but others aren't and figuring out which is which is pretty impossible for an outsider.

[-] kilgore_trout@feddit.it 2 points 1 year ago

This is why KDE has been focusing on hardware vendors for a while.

[-] MotoAsh@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

Hopefully they make some in roads. KDE is what I'd recommend for Windows users for sure. XFCE is great too but it feels a little... raw? compared to KDE. Definitely an upside for efficiency, but I think normies would much more appreciate the full-featured feel of KDE.

[-] Poopmeister@lemm.ee 12 points 1 year ago

After I bought steam deck I installed linux on my desktop as a daily driver. Really happy with the results

[-] KpntAutismus@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

i currently run linux mint on an old laptop and try to use it every once in a while. it really is getting more competitive everyday. not ready to switch just yet, but i'm already mostly using open source software which could run on linux natively.

[-] joyofpeanuts@beehaw.org 61 points 1 year ago

The reverse is equally true, if not more: Linux and Free Software are Wonderful Contributors To Valve Business. You know the expression about "standing on the shoulder of giants." Anyway, kudos to Valve. Don't become evil like the other big tech co's.

[-] randomaside@lemmy.dbzer0.com 41 points 1 year ago

This platform is the best thing to happen in the computing landscape in a very very long time. If the Deck can become the target platform for developers due to the install base, we're going to see more legitimate gaming hardware and software come out alongside it.

There are a glut of gaming handhelds out there running android or windows but there are a few that rise to the top as the pinnacle of the platform. When a clear winner emerges, everyone else tries to be like it enough while having something new to offer.

This problem with windows (one of the many) is almost all the value ads like game hubs (i.e. ROG Armoy Crate) detract from the experience and almost provide a superficial "ooh she diff'rent" appeal.

With the contribution of their work back to the Linux community, imagine Asus deploying their own Linux OS that ran steam. They too would be inclined to contribute back to the larger ecosystem while providing actual added value of substance!

I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir here but I'm just so happy about the success of the steam deck that it makes me want to evangelize it in my spare time!

[-] verysoft@kbin.social 41 points 1 year ago

I cant even tell Steam Deck is Linux, it actually runs really well.

[-] phx@lemmy.ca 8 points 1 year ago

Yeah. There are a few things like that. Other than catching the but screen you'd never know what OS is under the hood

[-] my_blackest_day@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Not sure what do you mean by well, I found issue left and right on a regular basic.

[-] NegativeLookBehind@kbin.social 27 points 1 year ago

Microsoft: "Oh. Be a real shame if...Someone fucked that up, wouldn't it?"

[-] BaumGeist@lemmy.ml 22 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Thousands of selfless individuals contribute to FOSS
Tech journos: 🥱
Some profit-driven business contributes to FOSS
Tech journos: ✊🍆💦💦💦😩

[-] autotldr@lemmings.world 19 points 1 year ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:


This shouldn't come as any surprise to any longtime Phoronix readers and dedicated open-source/Linux enthusiasts, but Valve with their work on the Steam Deck and SteamOS have been lifting the open-source ecosystem as a whole.

A talk this week at the Linux Foundation Europe's Open-Source Summit highlighted some of the great and ongoing contributions by Valve and their partners.

Alberto Garcia of the open-source consulting firm Igalia, which continues to collaborate with Valve on some of these Linux ecosystem improvements, talked at length around how SteamOS is contributing to the Linux ecosystem.

SteamOS is built atop Arch Linux with a GNU user-space and systemd, the desktop mode features KDE Plasma to which Valve has funded some improvements there, Valve's Steam Play / Proton that leverages Wine has been immensely valuable to Linux gamers and enthusiasts along with related open-source projects like DXVK / VKD3D-Proton, and then there's also they work they are doing around AMD color management / HDR.

Not just to the AMD graphics drivers for benefiting the Steam Deck's hardware but also to Zink OpenGL-on-Vulkan and then other common infrastructure.

There has also been other efforts Valve has been involved in such on expanding case insensitive file-system support on Linux, various other kernel features, their Gamescope Wayland compositor, immutable software updates, and Flatpak.


The original article contains 366 words, the summary contains 215 words. Saved 41%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

[-] Pantherina@feddit.de 9 points 1 year ago

Google, Meta and Samsung too. You can be 90% FOSS, 10% complete tracking. Thats enough

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this post was submitted on 22 Sep 2023
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Linux

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From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Linux is a family of open source Unix-like operating systems based on the Linux kernel, an operating system kernel first released on September 17, 1991 by Linus Torvalds. Linux is typically packaged in a Linux distribution (or distro for short).

Distributions include the Linux kernel and supporting system software and libraries, many of which are provided by the GNU Project. Many Linux distributions use the word "Linux" in their name, but the Free Software Foundation uses the name GNU/Linux to emphasize the importance of GNU software, causing some controversy.

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