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[-] TheTechnician27@lemmy.world 89 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

I'll note too that even absent Heritage Foundation threats, this can be useful to spur development of the project (i.e. for people who don't want a permanent account but don't feel comfortable having their IP permanently, publicly attached to edits). Probably the reason it hasn't been done in the past is it's almost certainly going to make it easier for bad actors to fly under the radar. Before, you either had to show your IP address (which can reveal your location and will usually uniquely identify who edited something for at least a little bit; you also can't use a VPN without special permission) or you had to register a single account (where if you created multiple, a sockpuppet investigation would often find out).

So there's an inherent trade-off, but I think right-wing threats of stochastic terrorism really tipped the scales.

[-] subtext@lemmy.world 13 points 3 weeks ago

Well you say you can use a VPN, but you may often see that you’re not able to edit using a VPN IP if that IP block has been used for vandalism in the past. So then you’d have to potentially revert to a coffee shop or library which would still identify your location.

[-] TheTechnician27@lemmy.world 11 points 3 weeks ago

Point of clarification: I said that you can't use a VPN, and that's because those IPs are blocked. As noted, you need to ask for a special exception, which for most people isn't navigable and may not even be granted without a good stated reason and/or trust built up through good edits.

[-] subtext@lemmy.world 6 points 3 weeks ago

Oh whoops, my bad I must have been reading too quickly. Thanks for clarifying!

[-] acockworkorange@mander.xyz 6 points 3 weeks ago

I was surprised I was blocked from editing even after logging in. They do hate some IP blocks.

[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 4 points 3 weeks ago

Make a list of necessary changes then go to your local cafe.

Sounds like a nice plan.

[-] blazeknave@lemmy.world 8 points 3 weeks ago

Doesn't Wiki still have the data? So a bad actor's behavior pattern can be seen at aggregate behind the scenes?

[-] TheTechnician27@lemmy.world 13 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

There are only 846 administrators on the English Wikipedia. This is across 7 million articles, 118,000 active registered users, about two edits per second, about a million files just on Wikipedia (most of them are hosted on Wikipedia's sister project, Wikimedia Commons), and over 60 million total pages (articles, talk pages, user pages, redirects, help pages, templates, etc.). So although they have this data, it's not useful if somebody doesn't notice and investigate it. Administrators are stretched thin with administrative functions, and that's not even accounting for many of them participating as normal editors too (tangent: besides obvious violations of policies, administrators have no more say over Wikipedia's content than any other editor).

Contrary to the idea that new editors sometimes get of Wikipedia as a suffocating police state run by the administrators, usually when edits get reverted it's because regular editors notice this and revert it citing policies or guidelines without any administrator involvement (every editor has this power). If an administrator intervenes, it's usually because a non-admin noticed and reported (what they perceive as) bad behavior to an admin, two editors are locked in a stalemate, or there's some routine clerical issue to be resolved.

Sockpuppeting, copyright violations, etc. are often (even usually) found by regular editors who notice something amiss and decide to dig a bit deeper. Even with automated tools that will flag an edit that replaces the article with the n-word 500 times in a row, and even given that some non-admin editors have tools which let them detect some issues, there's just only so much that 850-ish people can find on a website that massive. For example, one time a few years back, I just randomly stumbled across an editor who was changing articles about obscure historic battles between India and Pakistan to have wildly pro-Pakistan slants – where treacherous India was the aggressor, but brilliant, strong, and courageous Pakistan stood their ground and sent pathetic India home crying with shit in their diapers. The bias was oozing from the page (with poor, if any, citations to match), and I can imagine this would fly under the radar for a while on a handful of articles that collectively get maybe 30 pageviews a day.

TL;DR: Too few admins.

[-] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 3 weeks ago

TL;DR: Wikipedia has been doxing its own editors since inception.

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[-] collapse_already@lemmy.ml 44 points 3 weeks ago

The Heritage Foundation is located at:

214 Massachusetts Avenue NE, Washington, D.C., U.S.

[-] pineapple@lemmy.ml 41 points 3 weeks ago

What does the heritage foundation have against Wikipedia?

[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 77 points 3 weeks ago
[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 18 points 3 weeks ago

The best counter to bias is in an openly edited project is contributing corrected information with high quality sources. So instead of spending their time doxxing wikipedia editors, how about actually contributing quality data?

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[-] Jumpingspiderman@lemmy.world 11 points 3 weeks ago

It prints the truth more often than not.

[-] Bonus@lemm.ee 24 points 3 weeks ago

How is that defensible? Are there no laws to tamp down online terrorism from bad actors like Heritage? I'd imagine they're 100% in the wrong for making threats of any kind but I'm just a wee layman.

[-] RushLana 34 points 3 weeks ago

The issue with "Wait that's illegal" is that it never work in practice.

If the heritage foundation decide to dox an editor tomorrow. The editor in question would have to file a lawsuit and go against an army of layers the heritage foundation can afford. Even if the editor win at the end, it will be a long and drawn out legal battle where heritage risk almost nothing.

And this is not accounting for the editor having to deal with harassment due to being dox while having to pay for a layer and fighting a legal battle.

[-] HK65@sopuli.xyz 5 points 3 weeks ago

And that is why making such terroristic threats should be criminal in the first place.

[-] Jarix@lemmy.world 3 points 3 weeks ago

They absolutely should be. Them being so doesn't stop the problems from happening.

It literally gives people in the US the constitutional right to due process, and that bedrock law is being massively ignored.

There needs to be actual protections for when the law is not being followed

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[-] CosmicTurtle0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 13 points 3 weeks ago

Even if there was, look who's in power. Even if judges ruled against Heritage, I'm not holding my breath of them getting any sort of accountability.

[-] ArsonButCute@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 3 weeks ago

The laws exist to protect bad actors like Heritage

[-] Zorsith 4 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

The internet is, by nature, problematic in terms of legal compliance because it is not wholly under the jurisdiction of any singular country.

You can go after hardware physically located within your own jurisdiction, and you can go after operators under your jurisdiction. But if you start going after folks/hardware outside of that, you're rightfully going to be told to fuck off. (Which is why IP holders burn so much money on anti-piracy lobbying and get practically nowhere)

Its the same reason encryption bans are laughably idiotic.

[-] Geodad@lemm.ee 3 points 3 weeks ago

No laws? Sir/ma'am, we have the 2nd amendment. I can't think of any law higher.

[-] lka1988@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 3 weeks ago

Too bad the 2A nutjobs and right wing nutjobs are the same people.

[-] Geodad@lemm.ee 3 points 3 weeks ago

Once you go far enough left, you get your guns back...

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[-] Owlboi@lemm.ee 22 points 3 weeks ago
[-] neukenindekeuken@sh.itjust.works 10 points 3 weeks ago

There's a lot of crimes happening nowadays by members of this administration. Add it to the pile.

[-] SplashJackson@lemmy.ca 4 points 3 weeks ago

What administration? The Wikipedia admins? What the fuck you talking about?

[-] piccolo@sh.itjust.works 12 points 3 weeks ago
[-] SplashJackson@lemmy.ca 6 points 3 weeks ago

Sorry, did you think the internet was only for and about America? Fuck you.

[-] piccolo@sh.itjust.works 14 points 3 weeks ago

The Heritage Foundation is an american organization. Wikipedia is an american organization. Do the math.

[-] dukepontus@sh.itjust.works 7 points 3 weeks ago

Dude, check yourself.

[-] neukenindekeuken@sh.itjust.works 5 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

As someone else said, the Heritage Foundation is American. They're also currently part of Trump's cabinet, and they wrote Project 2025 which his administration is largely through enacting already. They've already heavily influenced American politics right from the top down, and are responsible for the vast majority of EO's from Trump's administration.

Wikipedia is also an American based non-profit.

If you don't understand this, then I don't know what else to tell you. You might be one of those can't see the forest for the trees people I hear about.

Edit: Lol, this guy went through my history and downvoted everything I've ever posted from yesterday on back. What a snowflake ;)

[-] MajesticElevator@lemmy.zip 20 points 3 weeks ago

I’ll never contribute to Wikipedia because they block VPNs

They should really unblock them. I know it’s not always easy to combat these problems, but a dedicated individual can break articles using non-VPN IPs like mobile data IPs

[-] MajesticElevator@lemmy.zip 11 points 3 weeks ago

They not only enforce IP bans on account creation but on every single edit you make, even if logged in…

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[-] qevlarr@lemmy.world 18 points 3 weeks ago
[-] RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works 53 points 3 weeks ago

The Heritage Foundation has threatened to doxx the editors of wikipedia because the greatest threat to authoritarians is information

[-] Zorsith 24 points 3 weeks ago

Wikipedia attempts to shield editors from being Doxxed and harassed by right wing nuts and their followers over writing accurate information.

Right wing nuts take offense at not being able to shape the narrative/history.

[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 2 points 3 weeks ago

I can’t wait for the ring wing nuts to fall back behind so behind from this massive web of lies they’re concocting for themselves. They’re now saying “vegetables are toxic and that you shouldn’t eat them”…

[-] stray@pawb.social 3 points 3 weeks ago

To be fair, most plants do manufacture their own pesticides that may harm small reptiles.

[-] dbtng@eviltoast.org 10 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Um ... This doxing threat seems like a really dumb move, on par with daring Anonymous to take you down. Really, if you want to play Internet hardball, there are folks that would love to show you how it works. (Not me!)

[-] Zorsith 7 points 3 weeks ago

I imagine this has been underway since whenever that legal kerfluffle in India happened

[-] cyrano@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 3 weeks ago
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[-] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Oh they decided to protect anonymous editors?

If Wikipedia actually gave a shit, they would have done this decades ago.

[-] Glaedr304@lemmy.world 19 points 3 weeks ago

The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago, the second best time is now.

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this post was submitted on 23 Apr 2025
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