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[-] kryptonianCodeMonkey@lemmy.world 228 points 1 day ago

Imagine if you weren't allowed to watch your favorite movies from the 80's or earlier unless you managed to have a still working VCR and VHS copy from your childhood. No Goonies, no Godfather, no Star Wars original trilogy. They decided to wipe these films from the face of the earth so that you could no longer enjoy them and had to go buy their new movies, exclusively, if you wanted entertainment from a film. That's what games publishers are trying to do, so they don't have to compete for you attention with older classics.

[-] rImITywR@lemmy.world 52 points 1 day ago

You can still watch those old films, as long as you are paying a subscription to a streaming service so the studio can keep making money off of them.

That's what video game publishers want too. Nintendo doesn't want to wipe SMB3 off the face of the earth. They just want to make sure the only way you can access it is to pay for Nintendo Switch Online.

[-] fsxylo@sh.itjust.works 62 points 1 day ago

*if they feel like offering it

[-] Grimpen@lemmy.ca 28 points 1 day ago

And this is the real cost. Sorry Mario Brothers will pretty much always be available as long as Nintendo is around, but obscure games or classics with disputed Copyright will disappear.

Who is out there even trying to stream the old Sierra games? At least they are on GoG, but I know even GoG has tried to track down current copyright holders for old classics and the are plenty of orphan games where after several mergers and divestments, there is some uncertainty, and it's not worth it for any of the potential copyright holders to sort it out and license it, and unfortunately it's not worth it for GoG to publish it to find out if they'll sue GoG.

This is why Abandonware is such an important concept.

[-] sp3tr4l@lemmy.zip 33 points 1 day ago

Except that that is largely not even true.

87% of games made before 2010 are completely commercially unavailable.

https://www.theverge.com/2023/7/14/23792586/classic-game-preservation-video-game-history-foundation-esa

They do not even want to be in control of retro games to be able to sell them indefinitely.

With the exception of certain, wildly popular games they know they can still charge a high price for, they do not want the vast majority of retro games to be legally available at all.

Further, with books, film, other kinds of art... a legal carve out exception does exist for the purposes of academic study and research.

Basically, accredited academic institutions have the ability to rent those out to students, people writing studies on media and cultural history.

Video games? As of this ruling, nope, they are special, studying the history of video games functionally requires breaking the law.

They just get shoved into the vault, never to be seen again, by anyone, ever.

[-] pastel_de_airfryer@lemmy.eco.br 24 points 1 day ago

This reminds me that 90% of silent movies are lost forever because there was no effort to preserve them at the time.

If it wasn't for people going as far deliding chips and breaking encryption, a good chunk of gaming history would be lost by now.

[-] TheBat@lemmy.world 3 points 23 hours ago

87% of games made before 2010 are completely commercially unavailable.

Would be interesting to know how many are unavailable because of licensing or rights issue. Racing games like NFS Underground or Most Wanted, for example, aren't available anymore because of music license wasn't renewed by studio.

Or many games aren't available because the developer/publisher studio doesn't exist anymore.

[-] anyhow2503@lemmy.world 30 points 1 day ago

This is such an incredibly naive take that has already been proven wrong by multiple publishers going out of their way to do exactly what you just said. There's also a ton of abandonware which is not being sold and never will be again.

[-] vinnymac@lemmy.world 8 points 1 day ago

You can still watch those old films, as long as you are paying a subscription to a streaming service…

And they feel like releasing the content you want to watch. And they don’t try to ruin the experience by remastering it. And they don’t try to ruin the experience by upscaling or recreating the film in a different style. And they don’t triple the price of content that used to cost a quarter of what it does now. And your device is compatible with their platform, service, and encoding formats. And the DRM implementation is compatible with your device, your cables, your speakers, and your ears. And you can pay to access that content in the location you happen to be living in, which is not always your choice. And you don’t have to buy a peripheral device just to access the content. And you trust them not to enshittify everything that you held dear about the original.

And and and… so the studio can keep making money off of them.

[-] DmMacniel@feddit.org 44 points 1 day ago
[-] SARGE@startrek.website 20 points 1 day ago
[-] DmMacniel@feddit.org 10 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

yes Chief, yes I did... and I did it deliberately :)

[-] Kolanaki@yiffit.net 20 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

It's just bonkers to me because they do everything for profit anyway; what the fuck profit do they get from not selling shit anymore? I said this not long ago about Nintendo, but other companies are guilty of it too. Spending money attempting to stop piracy, instead of making money by just giving customers what they fucking want. What crazy company secrets are they hiding that not continuing to sell a product is better than selling it?

[-] CosmicTurtle0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 13 points 1 day ago

It's like a toxic romantic partner: if I can't make a lot of money doing this one thing, then no one can.

Come to think of it, a lot of late stage capitalism behavior is like a toxic partner.

[-] thatKamGuy@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 day ago

Not in any way defending Nintendo - seriously, fuck them, I will pirate their entire catalogue and not feel one iota of guilt.

But, what mix of those 87% of games no longer commercially available fall into one of these three categories:

  1. yearly releases of game franchises (e.g. FIFA/NFL/NHL/NBA ‘94, ‘95, ‘96 etc.)
  2. unofficial releases (e.g. bootleg Christian NES carts)
  3. impossible to re-release 1:1 due to music licensing issues (anything with EA TRAX, Vice City/San Andreas etc.)

So I guess what I’m asking is, what percentage of those games aren’t economically viable to resell, or are stuck in licence limbo?

[-] randon31415@lemmy.world 15 points 1 day ago

Sort of like how they erased all the evidence of "Sinbad's Shazaam" and then gaslit everyone that remembered it?

[-] philthi@lemmy.world 11 points 1 day ago

~~Buy~~ stream their new movies.

FTFY

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[-] altima_neo@lemmy.zip 24 points 1 day ago

Stupid thing is, if they sold it, people would still buy it, even if it was easy to pirate.

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[-] MrSilkworm@lemmy.world 32 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Video games always used to be an economic way of entertainment. With an amount equal to a restaurant dinner you could be entertained for hundreds of hours.

Nowadays, video games follow the trend of enshitification. Low quality, repeated material, bad gaming experience, data hoarding, the need to be always online even for a single player game and of course, the "you don't own, we can take it away anytime we want" mentality.

According to the court rulling, if you essentially want to play retro games, you should find a way to access the original hardware and run the software in mostly proprietary mediums like cartridges that could be damaged or corrupted. And the reason you can't do it is because you may actually have fun!

This ruling is so bongers it blows my mind.

So you should never, ever ever

  1. Use emulators like Retroarch
  2. Find the ROMs of various systems you like in various "archives" through the interwebs for research purposes ofcourse
  3. Use a frontend like ES-DE or launchbox to make things look beautiful.
  4. Scrape content through screenscraper or something similar to make your frontends even more beautiful. 5.Keep in mind that this combo ( Retroarch + frontend) works in mostly cross platform (windows, Linux, android etc.)

After all, as a researcher you have to be able to tinker a little bit.

Enjoy your research ;)

[-] jaybone@lemmy.world 32 points 1 day ago

The library shouldn’t preserve books because people might read them.

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[-] Phoenicianpirate@lemm.ee 30 points 1 day ago

Fuck this, fuck these guys, and fuck them to hell.

I said this many years ago and I will say it again on here to be brief: Emulation and amateur game preservation by moving them from their original media (such as floppy disks, tapes, CDs, and other physical media) onto newer stuff and be able to move it around better is an act of historical defiance.

You see, throughout history, especially in the past 150 years or so, almost all early iterations of recorded media are just gone. Whether it is cylinder recordings from the late 19th century that preserved human voices, to the first music records, to the first silent film, and even the early talkies. 90% of all silent movies from all over the world are lost. What we have available is only a small sample of what existed. Even 75% of all early sound film from the first half of the 1930s are gone. For non-Western countries the number can be higher. The first ever South Asian language sound film is lost, and practically all films made in Indonesia from 1945 and back are also gone. Have you ever noticed how in terms of music, almost all the Christmas jingles are from the late 40s to 50s? There were a lot made before then, and it isn't just because the newer stuff is more relatable... a lot of the older stuff just doesn't exist anymore.

For TV, the majority of the first broadcasts were never recorded. Even as late as the 1960s some TV stars from Canada will never have their work shown because they were broadcast live and never recorded.

The list goes on and on... except for video games.

For video games that rule was broken. We have early computer adventure games from the 1970s that we can still play, ditto for console games and arcade games. The original Pong and Computer Space are still playable by anyone. The Atari 2600's original game library is almost 100% preserved, with even the destruction of E.T. the video game en masse anyone can play it (I have it on emulation, because every single Atari game ever made so small that they take no space).

All legal attacks on emulation have failed ever since the 90s. Look up the history of MAME to see how hard amateurs have fought to allow us to revisit the classics and allow people for generations to come to see what things were like before they were born.

[-] cybervseas@lemmy.world 108 points 1 day ago

Not The Onion version: "'People might actually have fun': Publishers squash video game preservation movement"

If folks today learned that games existed which could be played offline, had no dlc, no microtransactions, no skinner boxes. And those games were actually fun, clearly the whole industry would collapse lol.

[-] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 55 points 1 day ago

Steal everything that isn't nailed down while you've still got a chance.

[-] octopus_ink@lemmy.ml 65 points 1 day ago
[-] olafurp@lemmy.world 25 points 1 day ago

It feels like companies are worried about people not wanting to play new stuff if they have decades of old stuff available. Just like movies right guys?

[-] MonkderVierte@lemmy.ml 1 points 15 hours ago

The hoops i had to go through, to backup my old end of-lifetime-DVD's on linux. Not to mention the people who figured that stuff out.

[-] Alexstarfire@lemmy.world 6 points 1 day ago

Watching a movie from 1979

Uhh yea.... right.

[-] SkyNTP@lemmy.ml 46 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Americans are so obsessed with money, they forgot about actually living.

My dudes. Money is just a means to an end. It is not the end goal. Wake the fuck up.

[-] Valencia@sh.itjust.works 15 points 1 day ago

I mean, it's not just Americans, it's the whole world. EA, Nintendo, Sony, Riot, Nexon, Tencent, and basically every other major gaming corporation are part of the ESA, who lobbied to kill this exemption. If left to their own devices, corporations will never do anything that could hurt their bottom line.

[-] SaharaMaleikuhm@feddit.org 20 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)
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[-] chonglibloodsport@lemmy.world 19 points 1 day ago

Note that this really only affects researchers/historians who were hoping to have a copyright exemption for controlled digital lending. This would let them virtually borrow a copyrighted retro game ROM file (from an archive such as the Internet Archive) and play it via emulation through the browser. I have actually played a few retro games on IA using their browser emulator and while it is playable it wouldn’t be my first choice.

For retro game enthusiasts who weren’t aware of these browser emulators not much will change. You still have the same exemptions covering abandonware for personal use and for playing multiplayer games where the publisher has shut down the servers. No, you’re not entitled to the publisher helping you run those games but you are protected if your goal is to reverse engineer the game code in order to create your own fan-made server. Several old multiplayer games have open source servers for this!

Also if you’re playing on original hardware then of course you’re still fully in the clear to buy used cartridges, make backups of them, play them all you want. Yes, some rare are super expensive but a lot of that stuff is due to people collecting sealed and graded games which really has nothing to with actually playing games. You’re not going to spend thousands on a sealed game and then crack it open to play it when you could just buy an open copy for far cheaper or even download a ROM for free.

Anyway, yes, these publishers are idiots pushing out crap games we don’t want to play. That’s fine. If their goal was to kill retro gaming to try to force us to buy new games then they’re still a thousand miles away from that!

[-] solsangraal@lemmy.zip 23 points 1 day ago

TFW when your entire 1000+ game library of roms fits in a tiny corner of storage on my phone

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[-] Schmoo@slrpnk.net 8 points 1 day ago

You're not allowed to have fun without paying for the privilege.

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[-] ben_dover@lemmy.ml 1 points 20 hours ago
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this post was submitted on 28 Nov 2024
869 points (100.0% liked)

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