Men do not seem like they are proud to be men, and this is detrimental to their mental health. We need to celebrate men instead of demonizing them. (kbin.social)

submitted 1 year ago by a-man-from-earth@kbin.social to c/men@kbin.social

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Original by u/Oncefa2 on Reddit. Still very relevant today:

This is something I noticed in a thread where men were asked what it meant to them to be a man.

There was only one response, which could probably be summed up as, "meh".

And I honestly think this is how a lot of men feel.

You are yourself first, but also you're a man, if you'll even admit to it.

Women on the other hand seem to be proud of their gender and actively celebrate their womanhood. You see this in popular media and on places liked Twitter. And it even shows up in psychological association tests. Women are associated with traits like "good" and "valuable" whereas men are associated with traits like "bad" and "worthless".

Men are never told that they can be proud of who they are. And many are made to apologize just for being alive. Instead of celebrating men, we attack and demonize them on a daily basis. And I think this difference in treatment and identity has an overall negative effect on their mental health.

Society thinks we are useless, and it is time for a change!

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[-] JosephTJames@kbin.social 1 points 1 year ago

I notice a lot of vague/personal language being used. "Men", which men? "Society", which one? "We", who is we? So I can only give vague responses.

I rarely use my gender to identify myself, but when asked I say I am a man. Proudly.

I understand why some men/boys would feel shame, my own shame came from my failure to treat others fairly/respectfully.

I don't experience that shame anymore now, back then at that stage in my life I was guided by men who had my best interest in mind, but cared little about the values I deemed important.

And now I believe that if you behave in a way that is in accord of your own values, you should have no shame.

[-] Pons_Aelius@kbin.social 0 points 1 year ago

Counterpoint: Being proud of something you did not choose to participate in is a post-hoc rationalisation and just a bit self-delusional.

The statement: "I am proud to be a man", makes as much sense to me as "I am proud to be right-handed".

I am proud of several achievements in my life and ashamed of my behaviour in others. A statement I assume applies to most people. My gender has nothing to do with either.

I do not take credit for the achievements of others of my gender (or of the right-handed...) the same way that I am not responsible for their crimes.

Humans, by our social, tribal nature, love to divide the world into in-groups and out-groups usually to the detriment of all.

[-] wagesj45@kbin.social 1 points 1 year ago

Being gay or trans is also inherent, and because of societal push back, we've decided that being proud of those immutable attributes is appropriate. Masculinity gets a bad wrap in a lot of ways, and the healthy expressions of it should be something to be proud of, in my opinion.

[-] Pons_Aelius@kbin.social 0 points 1 year ago

Good point but Lgbt+ people have been shamed and criminalised for simply existing for centuries. Their use of pride is in reaction to that imposed shame. The black pride movement in the 1970s is the same, a group rejecting an innate trait as a reason for shame.

While males have been the dominate gender for basically all of recorded history. While aspects of male behaviour have come under, in my opinion, much needed scrutiny in recent times, I think talking about the issues of males violence (against man and woman) and other problematic behaviours needing to change is a long way from telling a gay or trans person to stop existing.

[-] RandoCalrandian@kbin.social 1 points 1 year ago

Apex fallacy and basically patriarchy theory, which we know to be wrong

A very few men had power in the past, as did a few women. To blame men as a whole is the same shaming bullshit that you justify lgbt people having pride for, contradicting your whole point.

[-] 1chemistdown@kbin.social 0 points 1 year ago

Since when has society determined that men are worthless, bad, or useless? This is some basic incel BS. Toxic masculinity, the need to be seen as special outside of any other achievement than being born with a Y chromosome and penis is useless and worthless. I’m male, and for so long in my life I’ve known so many men who think they deserve respect, special treatment, sex, money, a good life, etc.; for no other reason than their birth sex. Being a male is not special. Men and women can suck, and at no point does their sexual identity make that okay.

What does it mean to me to be a man? The right now it is modeling how to be a better person for my children. It’s really hard to ask them to try harder when I do not. So being a man to me, right now, is being a better, more patient, more accepting human. Accepting all of our faults and working from there. How can I teach my children to calm themselves in the face of the world when I will not? So being a man to me is being a better father, and working on that daily. Every day I work on being better than the day before.

So, you want me to one line it? Being a man means I show up and put the effort in to make myself better daily.

[-] thestrugglingstudent@kbin.social 1 points 1 year ago

Seeing someone who perceives a double standard and immediately calling them an incel runs counter to your argument. That basic lack of empathy is part of the problem. This is the kind of demonization this post is talking about.

[-] a-man-from-earth@kbin.social 1 points 1 year ago

We don't use incel as a slur here, nor do we use the toxic term 'toxic masculinity' unironically here. Comment removed.

this post was submitted on 22 Jul 2023

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