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196 Stands with Palestine, but those of you in the US should still vote in the general election. (self.196)

submitted 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) by moss to c/196

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I've been seeing a lot of anti-voting sentiment going around. Can't believe I have to say this, but you need to vote. Not only is there more to the election than just the president. (State policy, Senate, house), but not voting is not an act of protest. C'mon guys

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[-] survivalmachine@beehaw.org 27 points 9 months ago

I stand with Palestine, and I'll be voting in the US. Yes, I'm voting for Biden as the lesser of two evils, but I'm also voting for a whole lot of other really good people who are going up against some truly evil people. I've got people attacking my schools and libraries at the local level. Not voting to spite Biden will hurt my town a whole lot more than it would hurt Biden.

[-] averyminya@beehaw.org 14 points 9 months ago

That's what I don't understand from the don't vote crowd.

Okay, nobody left leaning voted. Now what?

[-] pkill@programming.dev 2 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

I'd argue it's not ultra-leftism if both options are reactionary. On the contrary, when going through such a turbulent period, to call yourself a socialist/Marxist and yet tail any anti-worker Democratic crisis cabinet is to compromise yourself just like the Mensheviks did for 8 months in 1917 when they happily took their warm seats and then didn't do shit to improve the desperate position of the Russian workers and denounce the Russian imperialism.

So what to do instead of voting? Join the revolutionary communists to end the endless cycle of disappointment and picking lesser evil in the system that gives no real agency to 99% of the society.

[-] cobra89@beehaw.org 1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

While I agree with communism in theory, some of the language on the page regarding revolution is problematic IMO and is not going to gain the party any favors.

Also some of the stuff they have listed on the site is pretty hilarious:

The German Revolutions in 1918 and 1923, and the British General Strike in 1926, show us that even in the economic powerhouses of capitalism, the contradictions of capitalism cannot be fundamentally overcome. In fact, in 1968, the largest revolutionary general strike in history shook France. This was a country that had been lauded for its high living standards, and it occurred during a period of economic upswing!

Literally every example they list of "the contradictions of capitalism cannot be fundamentally overcome" is an example of a country that is still capitalist lol. (Maybe because the real life examples of communism objectively haven't turned out that great.) So they've continued to overcome them. And sure you can argue a country like France has a lot of socialist programs and legislation but it's certainly still a capitalist country.

[-] pkill@programming.dev 2 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Because to resolve them a revolutionary situation is necessary first, and then some class leadership ready to lead it towards victory. Instead the impasse or temporary fixes for social peace will just continue into years of unresolved tensions erupting every once in a while but not achieving much. I.e. when

(1) when it is impossible for the ruling classes to maintain their rule without any change; when there is a crisis, in one form or another, among the “upper classes,” a crisis in the policy of the ruling class, leading to a fissure through which the discontent and indignation of the oppressed classes burst forth. For a revolution to take place, it is usually insufficient for “the lower classes not to want” to live in the old way; it is also necessary that “the upper classes should be unable” to live in the old way; (2) when the suffering and want of the oppressed classes have grown more acute than usual; (3) when, as a consequence of the above causes, there is a considerable increase in the activity of the masses, who uncomplainingly allow themselves to be robbed in “peace time,” but, in turbulent times, are drawn both by all the circumstances of the crisis and by the “upper classes” themselves into independent historical action.

[-] pkill@programming.dev 2 points 9 months ago

lol if you want to defend your community, join SRA instead of relying on a state that will not back down when tried, just like the French bourgeoisie used an enemy army to suppress an uprising by the French workers 150 years ago.

[-] survivalmachine@beehaw.org 10 points 9 months ago

Lol, I do far more for my community than joining some neutered gun club, but thank you for your concern.

[-] pkill@programming.dev 2 points 9 months ago

yet the black panthers actually taught us the value and the power of the oppressed being able to defend themselves. imagine what if they were still around for the BLM movement if it wasn't for cointelpro.