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submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by gabe@literature.cafe to c/selfhosted@lemmy.world

I am seeing a lot of fearmongering and misinformation regarding recent events (CSAM being posted in now closed large lemmy.world communities). I say this as someone who brought attention to this with other admins as I noticed things were federating out.

Yes, this is an issue and what has happened in regards to CSAM is deeply troubling but there are solutions and ideas being discussed and worked on as we speak. This is not just a lemmy issue but an overall internet issue that affects all forms of social media, there is no clear cut solution but most jurisdictions have some form of safe harbor policy for server operators operating in good faith.

A good analogy to think of here is if someone was to drop something illegal into your yard that is open to the public. If someone stumbled upon said items you aren't going to be hunted down for it unless there is evidence showing you knew about the items and left them there without reporting them or selling/trading said items. If someone comes up to you and says "hey, there's this illegal thing on your property" you report it and hand it over to the relevant authorities and potentially look at security cameras if you have any and send them over with the authorities then you'd be fine.

A similar principle exists online, specifically on platforms such as this. Obviously the FBI is going to raid whoever they want and will find reasons to if they need to, but I can tell you for near certainty they probably aren't as concerned with a bunch of nerds hosting a (currently) niche software created by 2 communists as a pet project that gained popularity over the summer because a internet business decided to shoot itself in the foot. They are specifically out to find people who are selling, trading, and making CSAM. Those that knowingly and intentionally distribute and host such content are the ones that they are out for blood for.

I get it. This is anxiety inducing especially as an admin, but so long as you preserving and reporting any content that is brought to your attention in a timely manner and are following development and active mitigation efforts, you should be fine. If you want to know in more detail click the link above.

I am not a lawyer, and of course things vary from country to country so it's a good idea to check from reputable sources on this matter as well.

As well, this is a topic that is distressing for most normal well adjusted people for pretty obvious reasons. I get the anxiety over this, I really do. It's been a rough few days for many of us. But playing into other peoples anxiety over this is not helping anyone. What is helping is following and contributing the discussion of potential fixes/mitigation efforts and taking the time to calmly understand what you as an operator are responsible for within your jurisdiction.

Also, if you witnessed the content being discussed here no one will fault you for taking a step away from lemmy. Don't sacrifice your mental health over a volunteer project, it's seriously not worth it. Even more so if this has made you question self hosting lemmy or any other platform like it, that is valid as well as it should be made more clearer that this is a risk you are taking on when making any kind of website that is connected to the open internet.

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[-] gabe@literature.cafe 22 points 1 year ago

Yes. But only if you are in the US and get an API key from NCMEC. They are very protective of who gets the keys and require a zoom call as well. There is hope cloudflare will integrate with other countries database as well but we will see. There is also active discussion of deals to provide hash scanning software to fediverse instances more easily as well.

[-] PriorProject@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago

... only if you are in the US and get an API key from NCMEC. They are very protective of who gets the keys and require a zoom call as well.

Do you have a source for these statements, because they directly contradict the Cloudflare product announcement at https://blog.cloudflare.com/the-csam-scanning-tool/ which states:

Beginning today, every Cloudflare customer can login to their dashboard and enable access to the CSAM Scanning Tool.

... and shows a screenshot of a config screen with no field for an API key. Some CSAM scanners do have fairly limited access, but Cloudflare's appears to be broadly available.

[-] hitagi@ani.social 20 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I'm not from the US and I tried requesting for one (NCMEC credentials) and this is what they told me:

if your company or site is located internationally, we are unable to register you at this time

The CSAM scanning tool didn't require NCMEC credentials back then. At least that's the context I'm getting from this short thread in 2021.

I also tried looking into other tools like PhotoDNA but it also isn't available in my country.

edit: just to add, the blog post you linked is old (2019). They changed the UI. If you log into the Cloudflare dashboard, it looks like this:

And yes, they do require a 30 minute Zoom call according to the email exchange I had with the NCMEC.

[-] Lojcs@lemm.ee 4 points 1 year ago

Why are they protective of the keys? Why not just make it available so csam removal can be easily automated?

[-] neblem@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Can CSAM distributors use it as a test suite for workarounds?

Edit: first draft was too declarative where I meant to pose the thought as a question.

[-] gabe@literature.cafe 5 points 1 year ago

Yes. They can stress test it if it is not under tight lock and key. It is why these databases are so heavily guarded and every new user for it are heavily vetted.

[-] Katrina 1 points 1 year ago

Because Child Sex Abusers would test their images against it to ensure they aren't detected.

this post was submitted on 31 Aug 2023
393 points (100.0% liked)

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