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She finds the whole idea absurd. To Prof Marci Shore, the notion that the Guardian, or anyone else, should want to interview her about the future of the US is ridiculous. She’s an academic specialising in the history and culture of eastern Europe and describes herself as a “Slavicist”, yet here she is, suddenly besieged by international journalists keen to ask about the country in which she insists she has no expertise: her own. “It’s kind of baffling,” she says.

In fact, the explanation is simple enough. Last month, Shore, together with her husband and fellow scholar of European history, Timothy Snyder, and the academic Jason Stanley, made news around the world when they announced that they were moving from Yale University in the US to the University of Toronto in Canada. It was not the move itself so much as their motive that garnered attention. As the headline of a short video op-ed the trio made for the New York Times put it, “We Study Fascism, and We’re Leaving the US”.

Starkly, Shore invoked the ultimate warning from history. “The lesson of 1933 is: you get out sooner rather than later.” She seemed to be saying that what had happened then, in Germany, could happen now, in Donald Trump’s America – and that anyone tempted to accuse her of hyperbole or alarmism was making a mistake. “My colleagues and friends, they were walking around and saying, ‘We have checks and balances. So let’s inhale, checks and balances, exhale, checks and balances.’ I thought, my God, we’re like people on the Titanic saying, ‘Our ship can’t sink. We’ve got the best ship. We’ve got the strongest ship. We’ve got the biggest ship.’ And what you know as a historian is that there is no such thing as a ship that can’t sink.”

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[-] MintyFresh@lemmy.world 122 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

That's a shit lesson to take from 33. My takeaway is don't let the brown shirts win. I'm not running from my country with my tail between my legs.

Fascists can fuck off, in fact ~~70~~ 7 millions just assembled to say just that.

Edit: I didn't think staying in my country of birth and fighting for freedom and decency would be such a hot button issue.

To all of you who felt the need to be condescending I'd just say tighten up and show some backbone. Real disappointing. So you may be shot and sent to a gulag. You wouldn't be the first, probably not the last. Try not to let fear and righteousness dictate your feelings.

[-] IrateAnteater@sh.itjust.works 75 points 1 week ago

If you read the rest of the article, she addresses that. She doesn't believe that she is personally brave enough to physically confront what is coming, so for her, the choice is get out now while she can and be vocal.

[-] cannedtuna@lemmy.world 46 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Not sure where your getting that 70 million number, but according to Wikipedia it was some 5 million.

Not to criticize, but I think it’s important not to spread inaccuracies and over inflate turnout numbers like a certain someone likes to do.

Edit: Lemmy post with final count numbers on attendance. Looks like it’s a bit larger than initially thought, which is fantastic!

[-] kn33@lemmy.world 19 points 1 week ago

Another takeaway from that article: 7 of the top 10 were during Trump's presidency.

[-] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

Oh don't you know? The media just has it out for him. For: illegitimate reasons we never have to talk about/s

It's not like people have good reason to find trump uniquely terrible. TDS!!!1 /s

[-] turdburglar@lemmy.zip 8 points 1 week ago

dang. what happened to the 11 million estimate i read about yesterday?

[-] phdepressed@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 week ago

Depends on source.

Need about 11M to reach the supposed 3.5% "rule" which is near what 50501 was self-reporting.

Traditional media was reporting 5M to start and has slowly added more.

[-] TotallynotJessica 32 points 1 week ago

The brown shirts have the keys to the kingdom, and so there's no easy way to get rid of them. By my count they've already won, and will be able to do a depressing amount of damage before anyone could hope to stop them. If you're a vulnerable group who has the opportunity to leave and isn't ready to die fighting, leaving is the safest bet.

[-] barneypiccolo@lemm.ee 30 points 1 week ago

The Nazis did eventually lose, but look what it took to do it. Millions of people died on both sides. The best defense is to not allow them any power, but they already control the most powerful military in the history of the world.

At this point, leaving is a credible option, if you have it. Unfortunately, unless you are wealthy, have a large business, or are incredibly intelligent in a field they want, most of us won't be welcome any where else.

[-] katze@lemmy.cafe 26 points 1 week ago

I’m not running from my country with my tail between my legs.

That sounds cool if your objective is to collect likes on social media. However, her objective is to save herself and her family from what’s coming. As "an academic specialising in the history and culture of eastern Europe," she knows very well what it is. Only an ignorant and arrogant prick could say what you said.

[-] Lucidlethargy@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 week ago

"The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything."

[-] katze@lemmy.cafe 3 points 1 week ago

That is iam14andthisisdeep material.

[-] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 14 points 1 week ago

I mean that's certainly fair, but with the vast majority of America either supporting the fascists or dragging its feet (cue "we can't give them an excuse to do a fascism!!!!") "fuck this shit I'm outta here" is, honestly, pretty valid.

[-] Harlehatschi@lemmy.ml 11 points 1 week ago

But going peacefully on the streets is only successful if the government you want to send a message to is listening, i.e. if it either cares for their citizens or is in any way rational.

I hope I'm wrong here, but I can't see anything changing for the better in your country. It currently looks like 70 million people trying to talk through a knife fight.

[-] aizawaA02@lemmy.zip 5 points 1 week ago

From the numbers that I have seen spread through social media, they were saying 12.1 million people showed up for the No King protest.

[-] PerogiBoi@lemmy.ca 2 points 1 week ago

Your usage of “70 million” is a cope just like her “checks and balances”. There was nowhere near that amount of people. Not even 10 million. The protests were largely cancelled because of the political assassination.

I looked for photos of protests and the ones I saw did not have anywhere near these amounts of people. A few hundred to a couple thousand at any one city. America is very okay with fascism.

[-] Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works 15 points 1 week ago

Bullshit. Only Minnesota cancelled protests during the manhunt for the conservative political assassin and tens of thousands showed up in the Minnesota capital anyway. And in other Minnesota cities and villages as well. Estimates range from 25,000 to 80,000 depending on the source. And it had no effect at all on anywhere else in the country. In Salt Lake City Utah an innocent protestor was killed by security shooting at a different man who they say had grabbed a gun and headed towards protesters and still 10,000 people marched there, in one of the most Republican states in the Union.

Seventy million is probably an exaggeration but your numbers are contradicted with thousands of news pictures taken from marches big and small across the country. And many more didn't even make the news, like the one at the VA Center in West Los Angeles where I saw men waving a huge California flag and a banner saying SEMPER FI TO THE CONSTITUTION! DUMP TRUMP! as all the cars across 6 lanes of traffic honked in support.

[-] webadict@lemmy.world 5 points 1 week ago

And for clarification, the Minnesota protests weren't cancelled. The governor merely told people to stay home while the police searched for the assassin, but they showed up at the Capitol anyway. Some of the government officials cancelled, but there were still some who showed up and spoke anyway, because Minnesota doesn't let MAGA terrorists dictate what they do.

this post was submitted on 16 Jun 2025
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