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Germans, please go to vote!
(lemm.ee)
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this post was submitted on 22 Feb 2025
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Sorry, but as someone who had their vote suppressed this time due to impossible short mail voting times (and this not being the first time) I have to sadly disagree. If you live abroad and not somewhere close to an German embassy, voting is usually not feasible without a lot of time and money involved. And without residency in Germany you are also not automatically registered for voting.
Do you have a better system in mind? Care to expose it?
There is a lot of potential for digitalisation of the process even if you don't want the final vote to happen digital.
That's not voter suppression, it's a risk you take when moving outside of Germany. The German state can't guarantee that you can easily vote if you move outside of its jurisdiction.
It affects all kinds of people depending on mail in vote this time including some that live in Germany. The federal voting commission has even explicitly warned about it.
As there is a strong correlation between mail in votes and progressive voters, and it was the CDU that enforced this faster than actually possible election, it is a classic case of voter supression.
And that is only the tip of the iceberg. There are a lot of other subtile ways in how the German government suppresses votes from people that are not living in the same small German village the last 20 years or so.
Voter suppression is not some big conspiracy, it is about people not caring enough to improve something because it ultimatly benefits them to keep it as it is.
No, the ballots were sent out on February 6th. That's plenty of time.
Source : I voted by Mail
Talk about being priviledged without actively saying so 🙄
Then explain me the privilege. I don't see it
That is typically the case with priviledge 🙄
So you can't explain the privilege? Otherwise it's quite childish to make a claim but then refuse to elaborate
Being ignorant of your own priviledge is basically part of the definition of priviledge.
But just think about someone that is working "montage" jobs and isn't home two or three weeks at at time. Their voting documents will sit unused in their mailbox.
There is a large group of people that have to use mail in votes because they don't have the time and flexibility to vote normally. This voting option wasn't invented for convenience.
That you can't even fathom that such very common cases exist, shows the level of priviledge you are arguing from.
You can specify another address where they will send you your ballots. And you can allow a other one to vote on your behalf
But yes, the rushed election date was idiotic. Normally you have 2-3 weeks more.
As someone working in a hospital I'm very well aware of this. But it was also invented for convenience, because it increases participation, which is good for democracy.
In Germany we call this a Unterstellung
People who live abroad permanently shouldn't be able to vote anyways. Also Dual Citizenship shouldn't be allowed
Well if you moved abroad permanently then that's a tradeoff you need to accept. DHL Express isn't also that expensive (50-200€)
You coudn't even get the documents to vote in time as the government surely doesn't use DHL Express, and DHL Express also doesn't cover a lot of places.
And it effects anyone that moves abroad temporarily for more than 180 days.
But anyways, I have the feeling that it is pointless to discuss with someone that is openly suggesting anti-constitutional and borderline racist things here.
What is Borderline Racist about my comments?
I don't think people should vote, who don't have to face the consequences of their vote.
It's the same things with Turkiye which citizens don't want Erdogan, but most Turkish Citizens living abroad vote for him. In Hungary and other autocracies it's the same thing.
I want a fast path to citizenship for people who want to live permanently here, or EU Citizens who moved to another state.
But if you take up a citizenship of another state you should loose the German one, unless you have a good point and apply for an exception. That's how it was a few years ago, and there is nothing unconstitutional about it
The old citizenship laws left millions of people who were born and raised in Germany, who went to school here and who pay their taxes here, and who have never had a home other than Germany without equal rights. So saying you oppose the reforms that finally allow these people to fully participate in our society isn't a great look.
I also wrote that I want a fast path to citizenship for those people, I just said I didn't like the part of the reform where you don't have to give back the citizenship anymore when you pick up another
You said that dual citizenship shouldn't be allowed. Do you think that someone applying for German citizenship should be forced to renounce any other citizenship in order to receive a German one? Because that's what the law used to be. And many people had and have reasons for not wanting to give up their original citizenship that went beyond the sentimental (not that pure sentimentality is not a valid reason).
If it's possible, Yes. I also think the old exceptions were sufficient.
https://www.integrationsbeauftragte.de/ib-de/ich-moechte-mehr-wissen-ueber/einbuergerung/ausnahmen-in-denen-sie-ihre-bisherige-staatsangehoerigkeit-behalten-koennen-1865126
German citizen are german citizen. There are no second class German citizen with lesser voting rights. Suggesting otherwise is clearly unconstitutional and about on the same level as AfD "remigration" plans, especially when you explicitly mention holders of two passports that typically tend to have an immigration background.
If you want to die on that hill, then I guess that's your opinion.
But if someone emigrates to Switzerland or the US to make more money and pay less taxes and becomes a citizen there, I think it's fair for them to return their German Citizenship and don't have a say anymore in how this country is run
What is not fair in my opinion is making decisions without having to deal with the consequences
Comparing this with Remigration Plans is completely out of place in my opinion
Right, because there are a few rich people that probably don't bother to vote anyways, we should strip a substantial part of the German citizens of their voting rights?
That's the majority destination of Germans emigrating, according to the German Statistical Office
I wrote living abroad permanently. So yes, if you moved abroad permanently , and picked up another citizenship actively, yes I believe you shouldn't be able to vote anymore in Germany.
The majority of German dual citizenship holders are not the ones that live abroad though. They are ones that actively picked up the German citizenship and live in Germany.
And as I said, this type of voter suppression primarily effects German citizen that temporarily live abroad and do not have any other nationality.
I never objected to them participating in German Elections. I objected to people voting in Elections where they don't face the consequences.
But I still think they should renounce their old citizenship if possible (If your country doesn't allow for it like Iran or Argentina then you obviously need an exception to this rule)
It is irrelevant to German citizenship and voting rights what other countries consider to do about their nationals living abroad. But most luckily agree that suppressing these votes is undemocratic and counter producive as these people usually still have a strong connection to their contry of origin and are directly involved with it in multiple ways.
That do be true.