This assumes workers own the means of production.
Under capitalism, boss tells all the workers to get fucked.
That which ought to be is not influenced by what is. It's true that worker control over the means of production is preferable to capitalism, but neither scenario here actually requires it. In fact, if the economy is fully automated, it would imply that the means of production couldn't be owned by the workers, since there wouldn't be any. That's how you get post-scarcity space communism. Socialism would ensure the longevity and existence of an arrangement that results in automation leading to better lives for everyone rather than human extinction. However, I'm beginning to suspect that with the time frame we're working with, aiming for socialism to the detriment of achieving any such arrangement might be a serious misplay on our part. Of course, that opens the possibility for humanity to be subjugated by an oppressive regime of immortal cyborg oligarchs. Even so, this horrifying possibility still preserves the opportunity for rebellion and revolution to set things aright whereas extinction would be ultimate defeat.
You just accidentally described both The Dune Universe, and The Warhammer 40K Universe.
Yay, a robot took over my job! Now I am free to closely monitor it until I stop caring about the mistakes!
Edit: And get fired!
Closely monitor it for less pay!
If I have no job, I have no money.
Who's going to buy the stuff these robots are building?
The search for short term profits doesn't give a fuck
That's next quarter's problem
Other rich people. Robots will just stop making $10k cars and start making yachts. Rich people will just keep the game going between themselves.
If people don't have money, people can't buy the goods being produced, demand will plummet and supply will skyrocket leading to the logical conclusion that a UBI is necessary to supplement life in an automated world. If that doesn't happen, I Guess revolution?
Woah, that's dangerous thinking! Why don't we bring back house-servants instead to give all of these filthy poors Gainful Employment(tm)?
Or…we could say “fuck the poors, my house servant will be a robot”.
To be fair though I think that the really rich will find another way to use us for their amusement.
Well, they have robots for the actual tasks, the human employees are just there so they have someone to lord over.
Automate your job but don't tell your boss.
Automate, but maje sure you take ownership of the production and get paid accordingly. Your tip is usually the best way to accomplish it.
unless you can spin it into a business to business service that you can sell after leaving the company to many more and paid more than your job's salary.
everyone here should look at the Venus Project. We keep struggling to understand how automation makes sense in a capitalist society. SPOILER: it doesn't. The entire system has to be re-imagined or we perish and the owners flourish (without us).
Yeah the owners are always going to get the labor as cheap as possible. There is no way you'll get profits from a. Company that literally doesn't employ you.
In the right hand pic the person doesn't work for the company. Why does the pic imply they do?
If a company is fully automated and has no workers do they pay everyone? Lol
If corporations cared more about people and less about money this may just work.
Until there is no longer a massive bill to start a company this is a pipe dream. Who's name is the mortgage under is all you have to ask before the model breaks down...
We should tax every company the equivalent of all the workers' salaries (adjusted for modern cost of living) they automate out of a job and use the money to fund a UBI.
I can only imagine what the cost of food would be under your proposed plan if implemented for all technological advancements over the past 500 years.
One of the biggest benefits of automation for the masses is that things get cheaper and more widely available. By maintaining the status quo and keeping prices high QOL would stagnate or decline.
Seeing how the US handles healthcare and social security is all you need to know about the future of any said plans for UBI. It's a nice idea but the republicans are going to drain it dry the second they get majority.
I would also propose that any company where someone is making more than the cost of living is automatically garnished to the amount extraneous, again to contribute to UBI. Under this system republicans can't exist because there is no corporations with enough money to bribe politicians.
So you're saying no matter what anyone does for work they only make as much as it costs to survive? That is how I interpret "any company where someone is making more than the cost of living is automatically garnished to the amount extraneous"
So basically everyone gets paid the same no matter if they work or not. There's no incentive?
Just trying to understand the logic.
To be the devils advocate here, how would that system be fair to workers not replaced by robots? Like if im a plumber i still gotta put in my 40+ hrs/week but a factory worker just gets UBI now?
The thing about a UBI is that it's universal. You'd get a UBI despite still working as a plumber. For you, it would be extra cash - for the factory worker laid off, it would be a lifeline.
Everyone would get UBI. Nobody would be forcing you to keep your plumbing job. And even if you stuck around, you wouldn't have to work 40+ hours plumbing weeks because UBI would give you the ability to chose what dmjobs youd want to take on. And maybe now that those factory workers aren't stuck in factories, some of them might actually want to learn how to be plumbers, meaning more plumbers to take on jobs.
I highly doubt most people are just going to pick up a trade as if it is a hobby if they are getting a UBI
No, but plenty would pick up a trade to get more money, for the same reason that people still overwhelmingly seek full-time jobs instead of only part-time jobs in areas with low CoL.
I know this is a popular perception, but it doesn't allign with the results of experiments where random citizens were granted an UBI.
have you like, ever seen people in retirement? they start doing labour just to entertain themselves.
I'm probably a minority but i would in a heartbeat. I stopped doing residential AC because the bills didn't get paid that often (people just don't like paying bills) and honestly i couldn't compete with larger companies while still having to maintain my epa certs, gas reclamation charges and the cost of refrigerant alone .
Or you put in 16 hours a week, and some other people do the rest of the hours.
On the other hand, we could also train the factory workers to become assistant consultants, or give them some other bullshit job...
Please, no more bullshit jobs, we have enough of those to untangle
the devil's* advocate
Many inventions created to "free people" ended up landing them with expectations to work even harder with their newfound "free time"—and they ended up being pigeon-holed into more limited jobs. This is especially true for women as appliances were created to help free them from domestic duties, but they have been landed into still doing those and working full-time or more.
this could be reality right now if we overthrew the owners. who keeps the owners in power? the conservative right. property is an unalienable right to them. what can we do? destroy the conservative right by any means necessary.
If you make the person on the right to be the next generation over, this picture is pretty accurate. Take a simple example: watch repair shops have gone out of business due to electronics - that sucked for them, but we're actually in a better place because of them.
Artisans being put out of work isn't better for society. Watch makers were a type of artisan.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean. Would you think you'd be better off without electronics? Are you saying you'd rather live in a world where clocks were mechanical and you had to take them to a repair shop every now and then? Is your life worse because watchmaker is not a common trade anymore?
Would you think you'd be better off without electronics?
No. It isn't a zero sum game.
Are you saying you'd rather live in a world where clocks were mechanical and you had to take them to a repair shop every now and then?
Some of them, yes.
Is your life worse because watchmaker is not a common trade anymore?
Yes. I wasn't able to get my great grandfather's pocket watch repaired.
What a weird example
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