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Gnome developers in a nutshell (lemmy.world)

submitted 6 months ago by deathmetal27@lemmy.world to c/linuxmemes@lemmy.world

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[-] HakFoo@lemmy.sdf.org 93 points 6 months ago

I sort of liked GTK back in the day when it was still the Gimp Tool Kit first and foremost. When it was 1999 and your other choices were a broken Lesstif, an early C++ centric Qt, clumsy Tk, and pre-Cambrian Xaw, it was nice to have something full-featured and tasteful.

Now I hesitate to pull in a GTK app because it won't theme right (I want to use the same bitmap fonts I liked in 1999, but apparently Pango stopped supporting them) and runs the risk of convincing the package manager to dump several gigs of GNOME crud on my drive.

I gather even the GIMP itself no longer tracks current GTK-- it's become solely in service to GNOME and their absurd UI whims (* * * * client side decorations)

[-] everett@lemmy.ml 43 points 6 months ago

client side decorations

Ah yes, the developers' dumping ground. App menus bad, five miscellaneous buttons (and also a menu) good and m i n i m a l.

[-] Scrollone@feddit.it 9 points 6 months ago

Oh my god I hate client side decorations.

I used to love GNOME 2, but now I've jumped ship to KDE and I love it.

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[-] m4@kbin.social 18 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

I'm with you - I was kind of happy with GNOME2 back in the day, but the forecoming of what was going to be GNOME3 made me jump out that ship and became a refugee in KDE.

It's a shame the Linux ports of Chrome and Firefox are written in GTK because of the reasons you mentioned. Once I heard some guy at GNOME talking about porting Firefox directly to Wayland - which sounds kind of bollocks for a pedestrian like me - but if it's possible, I hope that they succeed and Firefox can become a toolkit-agnostic web browser.

But at the same time I wonder about projects like Xfce and if they ever decide to move away from GTK, like LXDE did. I mean, a fusion between Xfce and Enlightenment would be awesome.

[-] HakFoo@lemmy.sdf.org 17 points 6 months ago

GNOME always seemed to be a solution chasing a problem, particularly once the licensing fears for Qt/KDE were settled.

But now it's one of the things Red Hat seems to impose on the world. Feels like everything controversial comes out of them or Canonical. I guess they have the commercial cash to prop up things like GNOME and Wayland and systemd and snaps until they gain traction, while more community-focused products can't break the world for no reason.

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[-] SeattleRain@lemmy.world 63 points 6 months ago

Meh, /g/ on 4chan which is where this post is from, is mostly bitter racists angry that can't pelt everyone with racial and homophobic slurs in the community. They literally think banning hate speech in CoCs is akin to brutal Stalinist oppression.

[-] Atlas48@ttrpg.network 53 points 6 months ago

Isn't this just an ad hominem? You aren't disagreeing with the point, just saying you dislike the creed that said it.

[-] deathmetal27@lemmy.world 31 points 6 months ago

True. But still /g/ is pretty tame and people mostly discuss tech stuff like this post. Now /b/, /pol/ and /int/ are another matter.

[-] onlinepersona@programming.dev 51 points 6 months ago

Gnome is written by, just hear me out, Malus workers in their offtime who got screamed at by Steve Jobs for misplacing a button by a few pixels. They wanted to write a Mac interface without some tech dictator breathing down their neck, but with the same philosophy of "we know what's best for the users".

Anti Commercial-AI license

[-] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 19 points 6 months ago

Gnome is good as it doesn't had a lot of complexity and looks nice out of the box.

I do wish the gnome devs would be a little more flexible. However, I also wish KDE had a dumb mode that disables the customization. Xfce4 has a kiosk mode

[-] ikidd@lemmy.world 23 points 6 months ago

So, here's a thought. Instead of removing customization, people just, you know, not customize things. It's like going into the Settings page, except instead of doing that, you don't do that.

Problem solved.

[-] niemcycle@lemmy.world 10 points 6 months ago

You underestimate my power, I see a Settings menu, and instantly enter a fugue state, 30 minutes pass and I suddenly come back to myself, my desktop environment looks entirely different, the windows are wobbly, and GTK window theming is broken.

I need help

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[-] UckyBon@lemmy.world 9 points 6 months ago

From your little comment we can tell that YOU think you know what's best for the user :) Keep it up.

[-] onlinepersona@programming.dev 6 points 6 months ago

Ah, a gnome lover trying to use reverse psychology. Cute.

Anti Commercial-AI license

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[-] taanegl@lemmy.world 32 points 6 months ago

Oh noes! Design spec?!? :( STANDARDS AND ETHICS?!?! No! I Want you to install my halfass, broken solution instead of waiting for a proper solution to come along! I'm such a special boy and know coding better than you! HOW DARE YOU HAVE PLANS!! /s

Like some of you are buffoons and need to go use something like Plasma instead. I love Plasma, not pushing that down, it's just that if you don't know the modus operandi of GNOME in 2024 already, you might as well give up trying.

At the very least give up complaining. You wouldn't have Wayland if it weren't for WONTFIX, ya daft cunts.

[-] 2xsaiko@discuss.tchncs.de 32 points 6 months ago

You wouldn’t have Wayland if it weren’t for WONTFIX, ya daft cunts.

Bit rich to say that considering the reason most very useful and well written Wayland protocol proposals that would get it up to par with X11 are rejected is because Gnome vetoes it since it doesn't match their vision for the Gnome desktop

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[-] rtxn@lemmy.world 22 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Design spec?!? :( STANDARDS AND ETHICS?!?!

FYI, GNOME recently broke Adwaita on non-GNOME apps because they started using nonstandard icon names without providing a fallback. Any way you look at it, it's GNOME shovelling the shit.

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[-] rtxn@lemmy.world 10 points 6 months ago

your comment doesn't include client-side decorations and doesn't link to a decorations provider, you'll have to fix that next time

[-] captainlezbian@lemmy.world 7 points 6 months ago

Yeah it’s not for me but its goal is to be the polished and distinctive option. Plasma is the “sure you can try” choice. And I love having enough rope to hang myself, but some people don’t

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[+] RmDebArc_5@sh.itjust.works 26 points 6 months ago

[deleted]

[-] RidcullyTheBrown@lemmy.world 84 points 6 months ago

I’m sorry but this is bullshit. Very few people complain about the speed with which things get fixed. I think that everyone understands that things take a while given the nature of the project. But the attitude is still annoying to the point people are turned away from the project entirely by those devs. They gatekeep broken functionality and refuse to help users. It has nothing to do with pay. If it did, they wouldn’t do those things either, they’d just step away.

Any developer with such an attitude should step away. And by the way, doctors do volunteer work too and they would absolutely be held responsible for bad medical advice regardless if the work was paid or not

[+] RmDebArc_5@sh.itjust.works 9 points 6 months ago

[deleted]

[-] RidcullyTheBrown@lemmy.world 49 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

my last interaction with that community, the one which broke the proverbial camel’s back was when i reported a bug in the notifications display. Basically, if a new notification arrived while the previous one was displayed, it would get queued but not displayed. When a new notification appeared after that, the queued one would be displayed instead of the new one. After this, the notifications would become out of sync. A notification from one hour ago would show up instead of the current notification which would not be displayed until a new one would appear.

To this I got the following responses:

To upgrade to the latest version (rather than the one shipped with my distribution) - huge waste of time and caused instability in my system and didn’t solve the issue. (Oh, and when I said that my system is unstable, the dev told me i should have used a “test computer”, obviously)
Then another person described how the thing is implemented and how this might happen with no solution offered. When I asked if this could be changed to always show the latest notification at least, that person told me that it wouldn’t make sense to not display notifications in order and closed the bug report as not a bug.

And that was it. One person decided that it makes more sense to get a display of a stale message to which i probably replied to more than an hour ago instead of a display of a message that my cpu is overheating right now . The issue is closed.

[-] herrcaptain@lemmy.ca 38 points 6 months ago

(Oh, and when I said that my system is unstable, the dev told me i should have used a “test computer”, obviously)

Hey, everybody, get a load of this guy. Imagine not running a separate staging computer and custom DevOps systems for your home PC.

/s, just in case you think I'm a Gnome dev.

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[-] deathmetal27@lemmy.world 33 points 6 months ago

I doubt paying them would fix their attitude.

[-] mofongo@lemm.ee 20 points 6 months ago

Don‘t they have sponsors?

[-] cygnus@lemmy.ca 7 points 6 months ago

Red Hat is the main sponsor IIRC. Fedora is the "flagship" Gnome distro like SUSE is to KDE.

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[-] Scrollone@feddit.it 16 points 6 months ago

I don't think I hate something as much as I hate client side decorations, "minimal" interfaces and the whole GNOME 3+ theming.

[-] Neon@lemmy.world 15 points 6 months ago

how about you stop being an entitled brat?

[-] felbane@lemmy.world 91 points 6 months ago

Guys I found the GNOME dev!

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[-] orangeboats@lemmy.world 47 points 6 months ago

Entitled brat? What... Have you ever seen how GNOME developers respond to some bug reports and merge requests?

Since when has reporting bugs and contributing to the project become an entitlement?

[-] Neon@lemmy.world 5 points 6 months ago

Yes i did. Reported a Bug relating to the workspace switcher and a bugfix got merged withing 24 hours.

[-] orangeboats@lemmy.world 16 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Did I say "some"? I think I did.

GNOME developers seem to have some sort of a weird "vision" for their software. If your bug report falls within their vision, good for you. When your bug report doesn't, it's insta WONTFIX.

The FDO icon theme fiasco occurred merely a few days ago.

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[-] Neon@lemmy.world 14 points 6 months ago

This Post and the Comments here are a prime example why i will never opensource any of my Projects.

Too many people here that feel like the Developers owe them something.

[-] Churbleyimyam@lemm.ee 22 points 6 months ago

Wait until you see how people talk about closed source projects they have paid for.

Same thing, except you will owe them something.

[-] sxan@midwest.social 21 points 6 months ago

I open source all of my projects. Most people I encounter are reasonably polite, but of course even my most popular is used by a tiny fraction of the number of Gnome users. In any case, I long ago stopped caring about being beholden to users. Often they're doing me favors and finding issues I haven't, and some even provide useful analysis that saves me work. A few provide contributions. But at the end of the day, I do what I do for me, and anyone else who benefits from it provides a small dose of dopamine from being useful.

I regularly fork projects and implement changes I want; I also file PRs, but in the case the upstream author has different opinions about it, requiring work I don't think it's necessary, I just let it go and maintain my own fork.

This is not Ideal Open Software Development, with many people contributing to a common goal. It's fractured and selfish. But the other way, it becomes work, and nobody's paying me for this, and so I give no fucks.

My mental health improved drastically once I stopped emotionally caring about the opinions of my users. I still care about the technicalities, but only insofar as they affect me or I deem them to be a superior solution. Key to this is not engaging emotionally; if I'm not interested in working on it, I just say so: I have other priorities, but an happy to review and maybe accept PRs.

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[-] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 9 points 6 months ago

You can just ignore them you know

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this post was submitted on 04 May 2024

404 points (100.0% liked)

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