Aka the market has rejected your overpriced bullshit. Adapt or die. Welcome to the free market.
It doesn't matter if you're a mega corporation and previously had the winning formula. You adapt to meet evolving market demand or you die.
These c suites got too comfy doing everything to only please their shareholders. They forgot that pleasing their consumers wasn't optional. We are your money supply. If you lose us, it all comes crashing down.
I just started waiting as long as I needed to, years if necessary, for the games I want to drop down on a sale to under $20. I really don't care how long I have to wait. There's enough games out there now to keep me busy.
Best example of this is the borderlands franchise. Wait a year or two and get the game + dlc for 80% off.
As an indie dev, this article is fucking stupid.
Want to know why indie games are priced at $10 to $15? Becaue AAA has been putting everything they've made in the last decade on Steam and it's all going for $20 - $25.
Indies can't launch at that price point anymore because they're competing with AAA games from 10 years ago that have been discounted to death.
The Steam winter sale is the best example of this, where most people will buy RDR2 for $19 instead of the new mega hit indie that's $20. So indies have been lowering their price to actually get sales. That's why team cherry priced Silk Song at $20.
Basically, AAA is now just competing with the bottom part of the market they spent that last decade flooding.
They're complaining about people actually choosing where to spend their money wisely because that means they might actually have to make a good product if they want to sell a game for $70.
Terraria has always been $10. Stardew Valley: $15. Undertale: $10. Braid was $15 when it launched, and even then, people were bitching about the price. So, the price tag has always been in that range since the first indie game launched.
I think you're ignoring the incredible amount of oversaturation in the industry. Games are everywhere. I could throw a thousand sticks into the wilderness and it would smack into a thousand different game studios, all working for years on their big hit that (in their eyes) would make them millions of dollars.
But, people don't have time to even play their own Steam backlog. On average, people buy more games than they even have time to play, and that's not even counting the sheer amount of movies, music, TV shows, YouTube videos, whatever that is competing for people's time. If they are playing video games, then they are not watching or listening to other media.
It's not just the gaming industry. The entire creative industry is propped up on the backing of a 98% failure rate, or sometimes even a 99.99% failure rate. The lucky few get to spout off their survivorship biases, under the bones of former companies and individuals, crunched under the weight of oversaturation.
My dude, I'm very familiar with the 14% of videogame players new game devs are vying for. And every one of the games you mentioned launched at that price because they were developed by a single dev (two at most) who could profit off of the $10 - $15 dollar space that was below the smaller studios putting out games like Shadow Complex, or Mercenary Kings, or Shank 1+2 for $20.
Now all of those spaces are being crushed together. Mostly due to economic factors. Thats where the biggest problem really lies, in the fact that people just have less money to spend on all that entertainment. Just pointing out that it's competitive at all is obvious my dude, but the direction its going in is one in where there's less anything being made (including games) because not as many people have money to spend on anything but necessities.
That's why AAA is now scavenging at the bottom of the totem pole, and pricing their older games at $10 or less on sale, it's because the few people that have money find that price point appealing. So it's now one that not just the people who made Terraria, Braid, etc compete in. The money those devs made previously in that space is now up for grabs to AAA companies that never had anything to sell at that price before.
Theres a very tried and true formula for any business, including making games, and in the last 2 years it has completely broken apart. Mostly due to the Embracer group merger failing, combined with AI, combined with economic uncertainty, combined with AAA companies stabbing indie creators in the back (Subnautica, Disco Elysium). Your game doesn't have to be a massive hit to be successful, it just needs to have a big enough audience to be profitable. But that audience has shrunk over the years as economies have tightened, and the companies getting squeezed have been invading markets they never had a presence in before.
So it's just desperate times more than anything. But that doesn't mean you can't make a living off of making games. I know dozens of small teams funded by government grants making small games you've never heard of to help kids in hospitals learn about their cancer. Or teach kids in underprivileged schools about resource scarcity. Making games as a business goes far beyond entertainment and the hopes of narcissists. It's an artistic medium like any other, and as such benefits society by making the toughest parts of it more accessible.
There's plenty of ways to run a company doing just that - and just because the world economy is in free fall doesn't mean the entire business of making games is something for the lucky few. It's just for anyone that wants to learn how to run a game company. Which isn't easy, but extends far beyond the simplistic view you are portraying.
I don't know about the main point that you are making, meaning that it's the economy's fault.
I only have a few data points to compare, but anecdotally me and my friends have plenty of budget to buy games, but not enough time to play them as the poster above says. I have such a huge backlog of nice games that I don't care to buy a game at release time, I can wait for a discount. If it is something exceptionally good that I want to play now, i will do it, but mostly on the ~20 euro range
So I will agree with the poster above. Make something exceptionally good, otherwise it compares with my backlog.
I think you probably hit the nail on the head here. I've been holding off on MGSV because it's $20, and I'm waiting for that 50% off sale.
Buuut, that didn't stop my from buying silksong at full price. Or Factorio. :)
Thanks! 🙂 Appreciate you confirming that. We actually changed the price of our latest game to $10 (from $20) because we launched last December and got buried by AAA selling for $15.
Almost every dev team we talked to this year felt the same about the $20 price. That is, it's much better to go out at $15 or $10 as a LOT of people see indie games at that price as better than modern AAA. (All while still holding out for classic AAA that go on sale for $20.)
And that being said, I'm totally cool with losing a sale to MGSV or Witcher 3 😁 Just wish the $20 space wasn't getting so crowded. It's making it rough for the smaller teams to compete at that price too now.
Honestly, if an indie game is promising, I'll gladly pay full price. Pacific Drive, The Forest, and Inscryption (small sale) were all games that I picked up because of interesting trailers, premises, and very positive reviews :)
If you asked me to name a major gameplay innovation in the last 5 years, I literally couldn't. Clair Obscur won a fuck load of awards for doing basically what Final Fantasy did 15 years ago, but not completely losing the plot. Hollow Knight blew everyone's mind for making a decent Metroidvania game. Balatro made a game where you make a series of combos that people have been making for over 200 years. You don't need fancy gimmicks anymore to be considered good, you just need to be good. Major publishers waste their time because they don't know how to put "be good" on a spreadsheet.
I would argue Expedition 33 is a lot closer to Legend of Dragoon released 26 years ago. Its claim to fame was the active turn based system pulled right out of that game.
Metroidvanias standard was set 28 years ago in SOTN. It has n
That crazy now that you think about it.
I would not put Balatro in the same category. While it isn't mind blowing. Nobody put the pieces together in the same way that Balatro did. I would still call it innovative.
I know of a major gameplay innovation in the past 5 years, though it's incredibly unpopular to many.
AI2U features NPCs that are run by Azure AI. The goal is to make the ChatGPT NPC do what you want so you can solve the escape room.
This gameplay feature hasn't really caught on, but I've only seen it be used recently.
I for one can't wait for them to stop playing their Azure Bill or run out of credits.
Yeah I pretty much almost never buy AAA games anymore outside of some very specific creators/franchises. Price is definitely a part of that, but the bigger things are creativity and business practices. Indie games are where all the new ideas are and where you get honest expressions of the artist’s intent. And you generally don’t need to put up with bullshit micro transactions, DRM, etc.
I’m not gonna pay $60+ for Call of Duty 500 when I can find full, fun, inspired indie games for less than $30. I will still buy the handful of more creative AAAs that do come out sometimes.
Because youre overinflated executive and managerial budgets dont justify the fucking price when games like Hollow Knight, Jump Ship, and Stardew Valley are 10x better.
Piracy is free. If you're charging 70usd for a game, then I'd rather just spend the time and pirate it. If it's 10 bucks, Im just lazy to do a Google search and pay you for it.
That plus so many games that are genuinely good and I have lots of hours into are in the $5-20 range.
Plus those 70$ games invest so much of that $ in fucking you with DRM.
Oh fuuuuuck the DRM. I purchased CIV5 for my phone and it requires an active internet connection or it boots you out. I only play on an airplane. So I ended up downloading the pirated version so I can play the game I purchased.
25 bucks? That‘s cute. AAA studios are charging $80 for remakes or $250 for DLC packages. They‘re out of their minds.
CEO and C-suite bonuses are the biggest budgetary fat that never gets cut and is fundamentally what the excessive costs are paying for. If you want better sales, cut the wage and bonuses to said roles who do the least work and reap the most reward.
I'm sure that plays a role. But it might also be worth noting that the market is absolutely saturated. You don't need to go out and get The Latest New Game to enjoy yourself. There are titles that are 20 years old and can stand up to anything the AAA titles will put out next week.
The marketing budget is what's driving a lot of the prices of these bigger titles. You see a Superbowl Ad for the new Call of Duty or GTA game? That's $5 of the sticker price right there. Sometimes firms are spending 50-100% of the actual production cost of the game to tell you to buy the game. Other times they're just going out to the gaming mags/influencer groups and leading you with "The game is coming!!!" news articles for years at a time, hoping to build a critical mass of pre-orders to fund the next title in the pipe.
Once the game is out, though, its done. Anything you can flip it for is free money for the owner of the property. So why not re-sell the SquareEnix back catalog for $10/ea? Tune up the graphics a bit, maybe spring for a few new cut scenes. You can take a title that landed on shelves in the mid-90s and turn it into another eight-figure release just by hyping it back up again.
I don't have the time anymore, the price isn't really the factor. Anything new has to compete with my existing library and backlog, and other things on my wishlist. It's a problem that's only going to get worse, games aren't really aging out of relevance at the rate they used to.
Each year there are only a few new AAA games that are worth full price. People be buying indie or older games on discount.
Why buy new bugged COD when you can pick up fixed up No Mans Sky?
No Man's Sky was an indie released at AAA prices and was a pile of dog shit. Feel like there are other games you could've picked...
It was another example of what is wrong with the industry today. It never should have been released in the state that it did. And despite Hello Games extensive efforts - we are still missing features that Sean is on record would be in the game at launch.
I chose NMS cause it is a perfect representation of AAA project that was dogshit on release but got fixed up to a promised game much later in it's life. It fits like a glove into "don't buy unfinished crap on release" category.
And if I DO want a triple A game, I wait a couple of years and then for a Steam sale.
Would be interesting to see the stats for revenue by game, price by volume. If someone charges 300 for a game that no one bought. Then it shouldn't count, hypothetically.
I work in market research. Data at this level of granularity (price band view) is extremely expensive.
Around 300K per year and that would also likely only include a few retailers GameStop, BestBuy, Walmart. I don't remember off the top of my head, but I believe Steam data wouldn't be included.
It's very likely Valve doesn't share the full dataset with anyone. Maybe partial data with some of their biggest partners.
i almost never buy games on steam itself anymore..Even on the steam sales. The sales are a poor imitation of the great values that they were 10+ years ago, and quite frankly..the quality of games coming out isnt what it was 10+ years ago, either.
I subscribe to Humble Monthly and, eventually, get almost every game I've ever wanted.
I don't even do humble monthly anymore. They've had periods of months and months where I don't get anything I want to play or some obscure game that isn't interesting. Its cheaper just to get the monthly bundle when I do see a game I want. Humble monthly was more than worth it maybe 10 years back.
i mean.. you can pause your month and skip the shit you have no interest in..
I think in 10 years of being subscribed I've only felt the need to do it like...twice? i think
For me I've had to do it for more than 5 or 6 months so to me pausing isn't worth the time.
yeah, if you're interests are super narrow then yeah it wouldnt be good for you.
Yah but the amount of shit games charging 3 dollars is insane. Really dragging down the median.
No it's the users that are the problem get more jobs idiots
...until GTA6 comes out, then all bets are off.
As much as it’s great to shit on triple A games, this is quite bad for the industry as a whole. Devs cannot price their game above $15 without being held to an absurdly high standard, which makes budgeting for game development extremely difficult for smaller studios. If we want the AA scene to expand and give us more great games as we’ve seen in the past few years, that’ll need to change.
Arc Raiders launched as a feature complete game, mostly bug free, well optimized, with a sufficient amount of functioning servers, and with genuinely innovative game design.
It sold incredibly well at 40 dollars. I've bought it 4 times myself.
Expecting every game to meet those criteria is not "absurd". It used to be par for the industry and it still should be.
AAA games from publicly traded corporations are just absurdly underwhelming. They want us to think these standards are absurd so they can keep their minimal effort bullshit gravy train running. It's not going to work anymore. That's the free market. Adapt or die.
If we want that, we’d just pay for it right?
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